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lekiboy
05-14-2007, 08:45 AM
Sumalinog is emerging as our new Larry Fonacier. He was connecting from the outside, from all sides. There was a sideshow involving coaches, coaches' wives, alumni and varsity players in the DLSU-JRU game which JRU won this time.


kwento mo na gfy... very interesting... ;D ;D

Jaco D
05-14-2007, 11:04 AM
There was a sideshow involving coaches, coaches' wives, alumni and varsity players in the DLSU-JRU game which JRU won this time.


Now this I gotta hear.

Bennie Bangag
05-14-2007, 07:36 PM
jaco, it's a petty asaran, nothing out of the ordinary by pre-UAAP standards, that escalated when it began involving the elements that gfy described. alumnus sa alumnus, player sa player, coach sa coach, at asawa ng coach vs. asawa ng coach sa kabila. pare-parehong palaban kasi, kaya umabot daw sa indoor parking area yung hamunan ng coach, namely the JRU head coach at the time vs franz pumaren.

gfy
05-14-2007, 08:32 PM
I heard that Coach Franz said something to the coaches of JRU during the customary handshakes that they didn't like. I can't say it here until I check it with Coach Vanguardia ;). Dave Dualan had to position himself between the DLSU alumni and the JRU side/bench to prevent the recurrence of the incident last year at ULTRA when two DLSU alumni went over to the JRU side.

glock23
05-15-2007, 05:47 PM
I heard that Coach Franz said something to the coaches of JRU during the customary handshakes that they didn't like. I can't say it here until I check it with Coach Vanguardia* ;). Dave Dualan had to position himself between the DLSU alumni and the JRU side/bench to prevent the recurrence of the incident last year at ULTRA when two DLSU alumni went over to the JRU side.


Gee, getting the side of vanguardia only would be unfair. Try getting both side's version of what happened. Thanks!

bluegirl
05-15-2007, 10:27 PM
I heard that Coach Franz said something to the coaches of JRU during the customary handshakes that they didn't like. I can't say it here until I check it with Coach Vanguardia ;). Dave Dualan had to position himself between the DLSU alumni and the JRU side/bench to prevent the recurrence of the incident last year at ULTRA when two DLSU alumni went over to the JRU side.


i wasn't there personally. but from what i've heard, nung time nga daw ng handshake, ang sabi ni franz pumaren kay vanguardia was: "wag kang masaya, di ka pa champion" or something to that effect.

gfy
05-15-2007, 11:43 PM
From Coach Louie Alas (after the Ateneo-Letran game): While about to shake hands, Coach Franz took offense at Coach Ariel pumping his fist down three times (I saw him do this before after a hard win). Coach Franz then made the comment which Bluegirl posted above plus more. Apparently, nag-kainitan na all the way outside. Mrs. Vanguardia reportedly said something like "konsehal ka pa naman" and so forth. Coach Franz walked away parang saying that di niya pinapatulan ang isang babae pero si Mrs. Pumaren ang pumatol.*:D Ngayon di ko na tinanong kung ano yun mga pinagsasabi nung dalawang chicks sa isa't-isa. ;D

glock23
05-16-2007, 12:47 PM
From Coach Louie Alas (after the Ateneo-Letran game): While about to shake hands, Coach Franz took offense at Coach Ariel pumping his fist down three times (I saw him do this before after a hard win). Coach Franz then made the comment which Bluegirl posted above plus more. Apparently, nag-kainitan na all the way outside. Mrs. Vanguardia reportedly said something like "konsehal ka pa naman" and so forth. Coach Franz walked away parang saying that di niya pinapatulan ang isang babae pero si Mrs. Pumaren ang pumatol.*:D Ngayon di ko na tinanong kung ano yun mga pinagsasabi nung dalawang chicks sa isa't-isa.* ;D


Thanks gee! I guess the next game between lasalle and jru should be interesting. Sa basketball court nalang nila ilabas ang kanilang galit, but not in a violent way. Battle of wits nalang :D Dapat si odette dinaan nalang sa ganda nya hehe.

bluewing
05-16-2007, 04:02 PM
nakapagtataka e no?

sobrang hindi naman kagwapuhan ang pumaren brothers, as in... pero pwede yung mga asawa nila...

baka magagaling sa "bola"-han.

any way... OT

a70
05-17-2007, 06:59 AM
baka naman nasa bigote ni Franz ang sagot dun ;D

gfy
05-17-2007, 08:06 AM
Sabi sa ibang forum, kaya pala nagka-initan kasi nung sinabi ni Coach Franz na "Huwag muna kayo sumaya, di pa kayo nag-chachampion", Coach Ariel shot back "Nag-champion nga kayo pero nabawi naman trophy ninyo".

Bennie Bangag
05-17-2007, 08:19 AM
something like that, gfy. actually it went like this. franz: "kung mag-celebrate kayo, kala mo nag-champion." ariel: "oo, champion nga kayo, pero wala naman kayong trophy." it's just plain and simple asaran na may napikon. ganun lang yun. mas malala nga mag-asaran yung mga pala ng JRU at la salle ;D

oca
05-17-2007, 08:55 AM
The winner always earn the bragging rights.

Kaya pag talo, tumahimik na lang at bumawi sa susunod na laban. Kung mamaliitin mo ang panalo ng kalaban - mali yun.

Ayan, minalit tuloy yung championship mismo!

Sana magkita uli sa playoff itong dalawa!

Teka.... nasa tamang thread ba ito? ;D ;D ;D

mighty_lion
05-17-2007, 09:48 AM
Normal lang siguro na me asaran paminsan minsan or me pikunan. whats unique here is battle of wifes. normal lang siguro lang player vs player, coach vs coach, audience vs audience. Anyway, agree na dapat sa court yan idaan sa susunod.

nightowl
05-17-2007, 10:27 AM
I would think that the winner should be gracious in victory, not pumping his fist while walking to midcourt. That's taunting in any language.

This is not the first time he's done that. Other coaches in the NCAA can attest to that. It's time his attention was called about his actuations. One can celebrate with his players, his crowd, but when walking to the other side to shake the hands of your opponents, some humility would be nice. Specially when some incidents had already happened inside the court.

Anyway, it's not yet over. One thing is sure, La Salle eliminated JRU from the ongoing Nike Summer League. In the Filoil/Flying-V tournament, La Salle is in no danger of being eliminated, so the two teams can meet again, IF they hurdle their group assignments and make the finals.

I hope Ariel V. can pump his fist in the face of a few more opposing coaches, along the way.

lekiboy
05-17-2007, 11:04 AM
I would think that the winner should be gracious in victory, not pumping his fist while walking to midcourt. That's taunting in any language.

This is not the first time he's done that. Other coaches in the NCAA can attest to that. It's time his attention was called about his actuations. One can celebrate with his players, his crowd, but when walking to the other side to shake the hands of your opponents, some humility would be nice. Specially when some incidents had already happened inside the court.

Anyway, it's not yet over. One thing is sure, La Salle eliminated JRU from the ongoing Nike Summer League. In the Filoil/Flying-V tournament, La Salle is in no danger of being eliminated, so the two teams can meet again, IF they hurdle their group assignments and make the finals.

I hope Ariel V. can pump his fist in the face of a few more opposing coaches, along the way.


C'mon guys, give the bombers a break..They have prepared a lot for these and the win is a major milestone for them. malaking kasiyahan para sa isang koponan ang nangyari. can't we be just happy for them? kung totoo man, franz should have just said: "Congrats, pare - Ang galing na ninyo. Goodluck sa inyo sa NCAA." Classy pa ang dating ni franz, tapos pa ang usapan..

I do not think our coaches ( red ones) will take offense if Ariel makes that gesture. Ariel deserves it and he has every right. Pag naasar ka dun, medyo sore loser ang dating mo...

Jeep
05-17-2007, 11:27 AM
I do not think our coaches ( red ones) will take offense if Ariel makes that gesture. Ariel deserves it and he has every right.* Pag naasar ka dun, medyo sore loser ang dating mo...


mismo, lekiboy.

franz should be able to take it as good as he can give it. who among us, especially the ateneans, can forget that "photo ops" he and his boys took to freeze that ADMU-DLSU game in which the eagles were butchered back in season 68? instead of letting the clock wind down to end our misery, they did that little skit for their enjoyment while holding us up to humiliation. or his smiling approval of araņa's jig?

now that the shoe's on the other foot, he cries foul? hhmm...

oca
05-17-2007, 11:43 AM
Di na bago yang fist pumping ni Vanguardia. Mapa NCAA or off-season game, ginagawa niya pag panalo sila.

Di ko napanood ang laro, pero there must be something that went on throughout the game that led to that "altercation".

Base on commentaries here and other forums, masyado raw physical ang laro ng JRU, and mukhang kinunsinte ni Vanguardia ang physical play ng Bombers w/c bordered on the excess.

Well, ganito lang yan and this applies to both JRU and Letran.

They will both play physical to start a game. They will play hard. They will "make contact". Deliberate!

They will continue to do so for as long the referees allow them to.

Pag walang pito, tuloy ang hard and tough play.

Pag may pito then they will "calibrate" their game.

If you, the opponent cannot take that, next game bring your own referee.* ;D ;D ;D

Bottomline here, kung JRU or Letran ang kalaban mo, before the start of the game linawin mo sa referee anong klaseng contact ang papayagan nila. Not because you want to know, but to bring to the conciousness of the refs na huwag hayang maging garapal ang contacts.

Bennie Bangag
05-17-2007, 11:55 AM
^^ ang sa akin, ang isa sa ikina-inis ng la salle fans ay kung bakit manipis ang tawagan sa kanila pag hawak ng JRU ang bola, samantalang makapal naman ang sa JRU pag opensa ang la salle. if i'm not mistaken, rico maierhoffer hardly saw action because he was foul-saddled, and they say many of those fouls he supposedly "committed" were incidental compared to what JRU's bigs were getting away with.

lekiboy
05-17-2007, 12:23 PM
^^ ang sa akin, ang isa sa ikina-inis ng la salle fans ay kung bakit manipis ang tawagan sa kanila pag hawak ng JRU ang bola, samantalang makapal naman ang sa JRU pag opensa ang la salle. if i'm not mistaken, rico maierhoffer hardly saw action because he was foul-saddled, and they say many of those fouls he supposedly "committed" were incidental compared to what JRU's bigs were getting away with.


alam naman natin na may mga games na ganyan ang nangyayari- when we played letran in fil oil, eksakto sa comments din ni bennie and nagyari - what's new? pero may gamot kami diyan.... si pong at si tecson...itong mga batang ito kapag dinikitan mo, siguradong tatawagan ka ng foul... hanggang umabot sa freethrow. ayun! siguradong di mo na fa foul next time..dahil halos lahat pasok. dun sila napipikon kapag inartehan na... a dose of a different kind of medicine.

ganun talaga ang letran, jru and even mapua, sama mo na baste- we even got some of our players injured - nandun yung pinatid si borgie several times and yung siniko si sam off the play.. these resulted to some suspensions. diskarte lang yan mga repapips... ito ang NCAA games na alam ko. pag medyo mahina dibdib mo, mapipikon ka talaga. Koy did a good job pacifying the players and worked around it. My hats off to sam, pong and the others for keeping their cool. A lot of them tried to provoke and defocus our efforts.

kung minsan, kami na mismo na alumni ang nang aaway at nanghahamon ng suntukan against the bench...just to drive a point na mali ang ginagawa nila - which works almost always. ;D ;D 9 di ba LION?) sa NCAA, di pwede ang larong "nana", pag lagi kang ganun, makakalbo ka sa kunsumisyon...uuwi ka pang luhaan.

bluegirl
05-17-2007, 12:29 PM
kung inis ang la salle crowd sa calls ng referee, then they should have taken it up with the referees, or the commissioner or the technical committee of the tournament.

tama si lekiboy, hindi na bago sa mundo ng basketball na hindi patas ang tawag ng referee. hindi rin naman bago sa college ball ang laban na may tirahan. and la salle isn't exactly one of those teams na hindi nakikipagbanggaan.

while it may be true na pabor sa JRU ang calls and that Vanguardia was condoning his boys playing a very physical game, parang walang kinalaman sa naging laro (or ung reklamo nila sa laro) ung sinabi ni pumaren.

glock23
05-17-2007, 01:25 PM
kung inis ang la salle crowd sa calls ng referee, then they should have taken it up with the referees, or the commissioner or the technical committee of the tournament.

tama si lekiboy, hindi na bago sa mundo ng basketball na hindi patas ang tawag ng referee. hindi rin naman bago sa college ball ang laban na may tirahan. and la salle isn't exactly one of those teams na hindi nakikipagbanggaan.

while it may be true na pabor sa JRU ang calls and that Vanguardia was condoning his boys playing a very physical game, parang walang kinalaman sa naging laro (or ung reklamo nila sa laro) ung sinabi ni pumaren.*


well, the next game will be interesting. We just have to make sure that their physical play will be noticed by the zebras. The organizers have spoken to both coaches, so hopefully tapos na ang bangayan. Abangan!

bchoter
05-17-2007, 05:26 PM
UST also had a dose of JRU's brand of physicality and Vanguardia's fist pumping. Nakakapikon (daw). Moreso because it happened in the Tigers own backyard. But then again, my friend, who witnessed the game acknowledged that Vanguardia earned it. And that Jervy and Gile (who were banished from the game) should learn a lesson or two from the Bombers.

brian
05-17-2007, 05:57 PM
imo, mas ok ang ganyan...meaning both teams were serious enough to get the win...pareho gustong manalo kaya a tama lang* asar ang natalo..i'm just so fed up of sometimes hearing that teams aren't taking the pre season tournament seriously..the incident proves otherwise...

mighty_lion
05-17-2007, 06:32 PM
Sabi nga ni Cheap Shot Rob, there is such thing as season foul and playoff foul. At times playing basketball is not just about skills and talent. sa isang physical na laro pangalawa lang ang tigas ng katawan, kelangan ang una mong puhunan... mental toughness. ang pikon at sira ang laro, talo.

muddatrucker
05-17-2007, 06:46 PM
Re fist pumping: I don't think Ariel V intended to taunt anyone, pero nakakainis talaga pag natalo ka tapos ginawa yun ng kalaban mo. But I don't think he did that to piss Franz off.

Re refs: One of the reasons why UST won the UAAP championship last year was because they knew how to work DESPITE the referees. They knew NABRO sucked, but they were able to adjust to the calls. I know it's not an excuse for refs/leagues to not do something about it, I'm just saying that you have to work with what you're given (unless the refs intentionally want you to lose).

bluewing
05-17-2007, 06:55 PM
it all boils down to CLASS and PROPER UPBRINGING.

kung meron ka nyan, at tama ang values mo, WIN OR LOSE, you will know how to conduct yourself properly.


BIGO KA SA PAGPAPALAKI, PILO!

nightowl
05-17-2007, 07:04 PM
^^ That's right, it boils down to CLASS.

Ariel V. did'nt have it with his fist pumping. He wins first prize. bluewing, your post (with reference to coach Pilo) gives you 2nd prize. Sorry, really wanted to give you the 1st prize but Ariel gets it. maybe next time.

bluewing
05-17-2007, 07:19 PM
^^ That's right, it boils down to CLASS.

Ariel V. did'nt have it with his fist pumping. He wins first prize. bluewing, your post (with reference to coach Pilo) gives you 2nd prize. Sorry, really wanted to give you the 1st prize but Ariel gets it. maybe next time.



i think franz deserves first prize for his sore loser attitude.

i'll settle for second.

and you get third for bringing it up and getting your hands dirty. you could've just resisted and ignored me but the "competitor" in you just had to get a word in, so your tenacity earns you an honorable mention. congratualtions.* ;)


but enough about us.


the topic is about the coaches' and their wives' little prattle so let us stick to that. diverting the discussion to tear down mere spectators such as myself does little to help your cause or shed light on the subject.

thanks for your time.

nightowl
05-17-2007, 07:30 PM
You know, you really do deserve 1st prize.

That's for dragging Coach Pilo into the mix. He does'nt deserve your classy remarks. YOU brought someone into the fray who wasn't involved, so you did digress from the topic first.

As for ignoring you, do you really want that? Methinks not.

bluewing
05-17-2007, 07:58 PM
You know, you really do deserve 1st prize.

That's for dragging Coach Pilo into the mix. He does'nt deserve your classy remarks. YOU brought someone into the fray who wasn't involved, so you did digress from the topic first.

As for ignoring you, do you really want that? Methinks not.



it doesn't really make a difference if you ignore me or not. i did not sign up here to play mind games with people like you because... no, let's not go there. i joined gameface so i can join in discussions about my team. but that doesn't mean i won't butt in a "mean" word or two when i'm in the mood because doing so can be amusing at times.

and no, my so-called "digression" wasn't as obvious as yours because mine was a mere postscript AFTER i said my piece about the topic at hand.

honestly, it kind of amuses me that that simple postscript of mine got you worked up. unless you are related to pilo or any of the pumarens, my "declasse" remark shouldn't bother you. they've heard far worse, believe you me. do they deserve it? maybe. maybe not. but judging by franz's demeanor, history and "scruples," i can honestly say, with a straight face, that my assessment was not way off.

as for first prize, i don't know. i'm honored, mind you, but i don't think i deserve it. you see there are other people who are FAR MORE deserving than i am of that distinction. because you see, i don't initiate confrontations or utter nasty remarks to my opponents when i lose a game, even when they pump their fists. and i don't go thumping my barrel chest each time i win either. and God knows i don't involve my significant other in any name-calling contest.

no, i confine my mean-spirited remarks here in cyberspace, under a convenient yet consistent pseudonym, where they may be read and viewed by other people who themselves are working under an assumed identity, mr. nightowl. and sure, i do let myself go every now and then, criticizing other people to the bone. but still, i don't consider myself worthy of the first prize because others do a much better job of being assholes in the internet. go to the "other" "school's" site and i'm sure you will find that the residents there are even meaner, more intense in their hatred, and more uh... opinionated about other personalities as well. will you award them first prize? somehow, i doubt it.

now, if you will keep your cool, my friend, i think the mods would appreciate it if we desist from this off-topic discussion and allow the thread to resume it's regular programming.

if you have any more gripes, please feel free to PM me, although i do not guarantee that it will be read or answered. depends on my mood, really. 8)

gameface_one
05-17-2007, 08:38 PM
ok, cool down boys. We are monitoring this thread. If you all just continue to digress, we will be forced to lock this up.

Let's all remain focused on the issues please.

Thank you and now back to your regular programming.

keempee
05-17-2007, 08:41 PM
there might be other reasons why pumaren blew his top, but if there were none (or even if there were), then woe to him. vanguardia pumped his fists in victory...so freaking what? definitely not as classless as la salle's freeze frame moment or wesley gonzales' taunting a fallen cardona after the final buzzer had sounded. give jru a break. at worst, his lack of magnanimity in winning is not uncommon.

lekiboy
05-17-2007, 08:50 PM
palamig muna boys...eto na:

I SMELL A NEW RIVALRY IN PHILIPPINE AMATEUR BASKETBALL!!!!

>>>>>>>>>>JRU VS DLSU

>>>>>>>>>>>ANIMO RIZAL vs ANIMO LA SALLE!!! bwahahahaha.

come to think of it....baka nga reliving the rivalry pa ito...
bentang benta na - rhyme pa!!! ASTIG!!!! ;D ;D :D :D

pio_valenz
05-17-2007, 09:50 PM
there might be other reasons why pumaren blew his top, but if there were none (or even if there were), then woe to him. vanguardia pumped his fists in victory...so freaking what? definitely not as classless as la salle's freeze frame moment or wesley gonzales' taunting a fallen cardona after the final buzzer had sounded. give jru a break. at worst, his lack of magnanimity in winning is not uncommon.


Amen. On the Scale of Classless Behavior, what Vanguardia did doesn't hold a candle to other stuff we've seen done on national television. Anyone care to remember Ryan Arana's victory jig?

arjay_g
05-18-2007, 08:38 AM
^ don't forget the batok-sabay-takbo incident. fist-pumping doesn't even come close to this.

oca
05-18-2007, 08:56 AM
To a hardcore fan like me, I am just glad that there is one team in JRU handled by a Vanguardia who plays these off season games with such intense desire to win. Iilan lang yan.

Why then should fist pumping be an issue to celebrate one's hard earned victory.

Gaya ng post ko kahapon, di na bago yan kay Coach V. Alam yan ng lahat na nakakapanood ng laro ng JRU. Kung ayaw mong ma fist pump ka, huwag kang magpatalo sa JRU.

Yes, there was mention that the "gesture" was made as he approached the midcourt line. Aba, kung alam mo paanong mag-coach si Vanguardia, laging nakatayo yan. At pangkaraniwan lang tumayo yan malapit duon mismo sa officials' table, depende kung saang bahagi ng court naroon ang bola. Kaya kung sa pagtunog ng final buzzer ay panalo ang JRU, kasunod niyan ay fist pump at sabay lakad patungo sa midcout. L1ntek, ilang hakbang lang yan midcourt ka na! Sabihin bang inaasar ang DLSU!

Pag talo, talo.

Sadya man o hindi ang pang-aasar, kung di mo kaya tumanggap ng pang-aasar, huwag kang magpatalo.

Sige, pag nasalubong ko si Vanguardia, papayuhan kong lumuhod at mag-cruz na lang tuwing mananalo sila.

O, baka sabihin niyong OA....

Sam Miguel
05-18-2007, 10:58 AM
I would never begrudge a winner from celebrating any way he sees fit, especially in our favorite game. This isn't polo or Wimbledon. Winning players and coaches, fans and supporters have every right to whoop it up. Short of committing any felonies there shouldn't be any limits to how winners celebrate.

As for the losers, learn to live with it. Its impossible for both sides to win in a game, someone always has to lose. If you can't take the style of celebration of the winning side just hold it in. Losers shooting their mouth off is what starts fracasses not the way winners celebrate.

Bottomline: Winners have every right to celebrate. Losers have no right to be cross or sore about it. Humility should properly be observed by the loser first, he after all having been vanquished. It is not acts of winners and winning per se that fire people up, it is the sore loser, since they cannot seem to live with a loss.

Coach Franz is a long-time basketball personality and politician (I live in his District and have helped in some of his projects). I would think he of all people would know how to be gracious, humble, diplomatic and under control regardless of circumstance, and especially in a basketball game, because that is how he has always been as a City Councilor. Jawing post-game with Ariel Vanguardia of all people is the last thing I would've expected from him.

bluewing
05-18-2007, 11:26 AM
ok, cool down boys. We are monitoring this thread. If you all just continue to digress, we will be forced to lock this up.

Let's all remain focused on the issues please.


he started it.... ;D




Pag talo, talo.

Sadya man o hindi ang pang-aasar, kung di mo kaya tumanggap ng pang-aasar, huwag kang magpatalo.



may kasabihan nga tayo na "if you can't take the heat, don't play in the kitchen." ;)

Mang_Roger
05-18-2007, 01:19 PM
Vanguardia is like a chubby kid wayback in grade school who jumps up and down after getting all your "tex". Para sa isang batang coach na nabigyan ng break sa collegiate level at may improvement na napapakita, di mo rin masisi yung tao na magalak ng husto.

Style na rin ni Vanguardia yun (pumping his fist) at isama mo na yung looney tunes na tie niya para makapang-asar din sa kalaban. Imbes na mapikon ka, dapat ganahan ka pang talunin ang JRU para ikaw naman mang-asar kay Vanguardia. Pupusta ako, pikon yun dahil ang taong mahilig mang-asar---pikon!

Teka muna, di ba La Sallista din si Vanguardia?

lekiboy
05-18-2007, 01:43 PM
Vanguardia is like a chubby kid wayback in grade school who jumps up and down after getting all your "tex". Para sa isang batang coach na nabigyan ng break sa collegiate level at may improvement na napapakita, di mo rin masisi yung tao na magalak ng husto.

Style na rin ni Vanguardia yun (pumping his fist) at isama mo na yung looney tunes na tie niya para makapang-asar din sa kalaban. Imbes na mapikon ka, dapat ganahan ka pang talunin ang JRU para ikaw naman mang-asar kay Vanguardia. Pupusta ako, pikon yun dahil ang taong mahilig mang-asar---pikon!

Teka muna, di ba La Sallista din si Vanguardia?


palagay ko, mapipikon sa atin si ariel vanguardia this season, mang roger... ;D
we anticipate a hard fighting jru squad this season pero siya pa din ang pikon pag uwi niya...let's see in june 24 - sbc vs jru ( opening game)
knowing frankie, ngiti lang ang ibibigay niya kay ariel - talo o panalo..

glock23
05-18-2007, 01:46 PM
I would never begrudge a winner from celebrating any way he sees fit, especially in our favorite game. This isn't polo or Wimbledon. Winning players and coaches, fans and supporters have every right to whoop it up. Short of committing any felonies there shouldn't be any limits to how winners celebrate.

As for the losers, learn to live with it. Its impossible for both sides to win in a game, someone always has to lose. If you can't take the style of celebration of the winning side just hold it in. Losers shooting their mouth off is what starts fracasses not the way winners celebrate.

Bottomline: Winners have every right to celebrate. Losers have no right to be cross or sore about it. Humility should properly be observed by the loser first, he after all having been vanquished. It is not acts of winners and winning per se that fire people up, it is the sore loser, since they cannot seem to live with a loss.

Coach Franz is a long-time basketball personality and politician (I live in his District and have helped in some of his projects). I would think he of all people would know how to be gracious, humble, diplomatic and under control regardless of circumstance, and especially in a basketball game, because that is how he has always been as a City Councilor. Jawing post-game with Ariel Vanguardia of all people is the last thing I would've expected from him.


Well said sam! Thats why dont take it against us when we did that photo-op against ateneo 2 seasons ago along with the arana jig! As you said, winners have every right to celebrate and losers have no right to be sore about it. But i do agree that what franz did was uncalled for and should not have stooped down to the level of ariel who was obviously trying to piss him off. Ika nga, ang mapikon talo! End of story!

glock23
05-18-2007, 01:51 PM
Vanguardia is like a chubby kid wayback in grade school who jumps up and down after getting all your "tex". Para sa isang batang coach na nabigyan ng break sa collegiate level at may improvement na napapakita, di mo rin masisi yung tao na magalak ng husto.

Style na rin ni Vanguardia yun (pumping his fist) at isama mo na yung looney tunes na tie niya para makapang-asar din sa kalaban. Imbes na mapikon ka, dapat ganahan ka pang talunin ang JRU para ikaw naman mang-asar kay Vanguardia. Pupusta ako, pikon yun dahil ang taong mahilig mang-asar---pikon!

Teka muna, di ba La Sallista din si Vanguardia?


palagay ko, mapipikon sa atin si ariel vanguardia this season, mang roger...* ;D
we anticipate a hard fighting jru squad this season pero siya pa din ang pikon pag uwi niya...let's see in june 24 - sbc vs jru ( opening game)
knowing frankie, ngiti lang ang ibibigay niya kay ariel - talo o panalo..


Lekiboy, pag ginawa nya yon kay frankie eh umbag ang abot nya. Di aatrasan ni frankie ang ganoong physical play at pang-aasar ni vanguardia. Garantisado! ;D

lekiboy
05-18-2007, 02:08 PM
glock,
di papatulan ni frankie yun...and in fairness, ariel behaves properly in the NCAA sa mga games na nakita ko.

- isa siya sa mga coaches na di namin inaasar from the bleachers...masaya kalaban ang JRU sa NCAA...kantiyawan lang pero kadalasan,di umaabot sa labis. kahit sa players di ko nakita na nagkakainitan...medyo magkakakilala na yata sila. I know cagoco is a good firend of pong and floyd usually chats with yousif and sam on and off the court. smiles follow after.

as for their fans, puro mga bata at di din naman mga bastos...maingay lang at matining ang mga boses... di din kami naaasar kapag sumisigaw sila ng ANIMO RIZAL - cute e... why?? the HS students are the ones activlely cheering, sisigawan ba naman namin sila? :D ...we know they mean no harm. sa mga mas nakakatanda, tahimik lang sila kapag SBC kalaban..

we also respect JRU's cheering squad a lot. they have a long tradition of cheers. the indian yell was claimed to be an answer to their "FIESTA Cheer".

oca
05-18-2007, 03:02 PM
^
Sana di magbago ang pananaw mula sa panig nina lekiboy pag tinalo ng JRU ang San Beda, either sa first or second rd. ;D ;D ;D

lekiboy
05-18-2007, 03:27 PM
^
Sana di magbago ang pananaw mula sa panig nina lekiboy pag tinalo ng JRU ang San Beda, either sa first or second rd. ;D ;D ;D


oca,
that wil be a big one for us - but history has taught is a lot to accept defeat with courage and hope.
sa mga bata siguro medyo aasa ng masyado - they cannot relate that much but for the alumni, medyo kaya namin lunukin yan...
iba na kapag NCAA season...let's see who will face reality in season 83.

brian
05-18-2007, 05:35 PM
Vanguardia is like a chubby kid wayback in grade school who jumps up and down after getting all your "tex". Para sa isang batang coach na nabigyan ng break sa collegiate level at may improvement na napapakita, di mo rin masisi yung tao na magalak ng husto.

Style na rin ni Vanguardia yun (pumping his fist) at isama mo na yung looney tunes na tie niya para makapang-asar din sa kalaban. Imbes na mapikon ka, dapat ganahan ka pang talunin ang JRU para ikaw naman mang-asar kay Vanguardia. Pupusta ako, pikon yun dahil ang taong mahilig mang-asar---pikon!

Teka muna, di ba La Sallista din si Vanguardia?


palagay ko, mapipikon sa atin si ariel vanguardia this season, mang roger...* ;D
we anticipate a hard fighting jru squad this season pero siya pa din ang pikon pag uwi niya...let's see in june 24 - sbc vs jru ( opening game)
knowing frankie, ngiti lang ang ibibigay niya kay ariel - talo o panalo..


lekiboy,

palagay ko ala mangyayaring pikonan sa coaches since matagalagal tagal din nagsama si frankie lim at vanguardia sa talk n text however, alam naman natin sa collegiate level laging galit galit muna ;D

brian
05-18-2007, 05:55 PM
I would never begrudge a winner from celebrating any way he sees fit, especially in our favorite game. This isn't polo or Wimbledon. Winning players and coaches, fans and supporters have every right to whoop it up. Short of committing any felonies there shouldn't be any limits to how winners celebrate.

As for the losers, learn to live with it. Its impossible for both sides to win in a game, someone always has to lose. If you can't take the style of celebration of the winning side just hold it in. Losers shooting their mouth off is what starts fracasses not the way winners celebrate.

Bottomline: Winners have every right to celebrate. Losers have no right to be cross or sore about it. Humility should properly be observed by the loser first, he after all having been vanquished. It is not acts of winners and winning per se that fire people up, it is the sore loser, since they cannot seem to live with a loss.

Coach Franz is a long-time basketball personality and politician (I live in his District and have helped in some of his projects). I would think he of all people would know how to be gracious, humble, diplomatic and under control regardless of circumstance, and especially in a basketball game, because that is how he has always been as a City Councilor. Jawing post-game with Ariel Vanguardia of all people is the last thing I would've expected from him.


Well said sam! Thats why dont take it against us when we did that photo-op against ateneo 2 seasons ago along with the arana jig! As you said, winners have every right to celebrate and losers have no right to be sore about it. But i do agree that what franz did was uncalled for and should not have stooped down to the level of ariel who was obviously trying to piss him off. Ika nga, ang mapikon talo! End of story!


if the context of franz's remark was like "para kayong nanalo ng championship" ala rin masama dun kung tutuusin..we make the same remarks all the time especially when one gets overly jubilant after a win during a regular season's game...

when golden state eliminated dallas, akala mo nanalo sila ng championship..ganon naman talaga ang reaction when an underdog upsets their opponent so i wouldn't fault vanguardia for that especially after a grind it out win..pero normal din ang obserbasyon ni franz na parang nga nanalo sa championship...di na dapat lumaki yun. however, i agree with you ,and some, that franz just should have let vanguardia celebrate in his own way if he felt that it was a big achievement for him.. :D

di naman pangiinsulto ang ginawa ni franz, more of kantyaw imo...ang sagot ni vanguardia pertaining to our supension ang pangiinsulto but it's fine by me..* ::)

Wingman
05-19-2007, 08:31 AM
I hope the people here can tell the whole story behind the antics of the coaches. If Franz behaved that way, I believe that it is a result of something that happened during the game. I heard the game was physical with some JRU players putting extra mustard on the fouls or contacts that they heap on La Salle players.

cl.blue.24
05-19-2007, 10:24 AM
There IS a saying..

Gracious in victory, humble in defeat.

bluewing
05-19-2007, 05:46 PM
There IS a saying..

Gracious in victory, humble in defeat.


simple lang yan kung tutuusin. di ko talaga maintindihan kung bakit may mga hambog pag panalo at daig pa sa batang paslit kung mapikon sa tuwing natatalo...

glock23
05-19-2007, 10:06 PM
simple! people have different personalities. Its actually not a big deal if it happened to some other coach. But, since it involved someone who a lot of people love to hate then its a big story. If you happen to be a F1 fan andknow of schumacher and the late great ayrton senna, they were touted to be the dirtiest and most "magulang" by other drivers. But thats what made them the best of all time! People either love them or hate them, but one thing they all agree on is the talent that they both* had .Franz is a winner and arguably the best in collegiate basketball.* Take him for what he is and just admire the talent. No need to bad mouth the guy.

1979
05-19-2007, 11:25 PM
Whew. This ain't even a championship game and you guys devoted what, like four pages to a simple post game incident? Hooowee I can't wait for UAAP's next season. The boys are back in town!

Tickets, anyone? It's gonna be a humdinger come July ;D

glock23
05-19-2007, 11:37 PM
Whew.* This ain't even a championship game and you guys devoted what,* like four pages to a simple post game incident?* Hooowee I can't wait for UAAP's next season.* The boys are back in town!

Tickets,* anyone?* It's gonna be a humdinger come July* *;D


Whats amazing is that there is not a single one from JRU posting on this thread!* ;)

bluewing
05-20-2007, 02:48 AM
while it is true that franz has shown that he is an able coach and is arguably good at his job, to simply take him for what he is and simply admire his talent is something a lemming would do.

true.blue
05-20-2007, 10:46 AM
I would never begrudge a winner from celebrating any way he sees fit, especially in our favorite game. This isn't polo or Wimbledon. Winning players and coaches, fans and supporters have every right to whoop it up. Short of committing any felonies there shouldn't be any limits to how winners celebrate.


I can't agree with this. To celebrate, yes. But to celebrate, while intentionally ridiculing your opponent in a public stage is not just unsportsmanly, but irresponsible as it can agitate people and cause violence.

Perhaps this doesn't apply to the JRU coach as he was probably celebrating on his own, though it was irresponsible to do that if it was while in front of the other team/coaches.

Or take the case of the Arana dance which was consented by Franz, or the unsportsmanly time out by Franz. Some La Sallites have always argued that asaran and one-upmanship are always the privilege of the winner. I say true for people in general but it shouldn't be the case for people accorded positions of responsibility (as in coaches, managers, school presidents, etc) nor for people supervised by such responsible people (players, ball boys, cheerleaders). Why? Because it sends the wrong signal about sportsmanship. It also can agitate people into a fight. That is why there is also a rule among cheerleaders since the 90s to never allow actions or messages that would provoke the other side, which by the way, has time and time again been violated by the La Salle pep squad.

paul_tamaraws
05-20-2007, 03:04 PM
with JRU's win over La Salle last week, for now the Bombers are sending a strong message to all NCAA teams, especially to San Beda in preparation for Season 83 next month as they will try to end their 35-year title drought...

"Bring Back '72 in 2k7!!!"

glock23
05-20-2007, 04:00 PM
I would never begrudge a winner from celebrating any way he sees fit, especially in our favorite game. This isn't polo or Wimbledon. Winning players and coaches, fans and supporters have every right to whoop it up. Short of committing any felonies there shouldn't be any limits to how winners celebrate.


I can't agree with this.* To celebrate, yes.* But to celebrate, while intentionally ridiculing your opponent in a public stage is not just unsportsmanly, but irresponsible as it can agitate people and cause violence.*

Perhaps this doesn't apply to the JRU coach as he was probably celebrating on his own, though it was irresponsible to do that if it was while in front of the other team/coaches.

Or take the case of the Arana dance which was consented by Franz, or the unsportsmanly time out by Franz.* Some La Sallites have always argued that asaran and one-upmanship are always the privilege of the winner.* I say true for people in general but it shouldn't be the case for people accorded positions of responsibility (as in coaches, managers, school presidents, etc) nor for people supervised by such responsible people (players, ball boys, cheerleaders).* Why?* Because it sends the wrong signal about sportsmanship.* It also can agitate people into a fight.* That is why there is also a rule among cheerleaders since the 90s to never allow actions or messages that would provoke the other side, which by the way, has time and time again been violated by the La Salle pep squad.



let me re-fresh your selective memory. the year 2002 when you guys won over us, wesley was taunting a fallen cardona and your crowd was jeering and humiliating our players. Did joel banal even reprimand wes for doing so? I dont think so. In fact everyone was enjoying it, including you im sure! Hindi naman pwedeng double standard, diba? You guys have a very strong team this year and the ghost of 2002 just might haunt us again. We'll see what happens! ;)

true.blue
05-20-2007, 04:31 PM
I would never begrudge a winner from celebrating any way he sees fit, especially in our favorite game. This isn't polo or Wimbledon. Winning players and coaches, fans and supporters have every right to whoop it up. Short of committing any felonies there shouldn't be any limits to how winners celebrate.


I can't agree with this.* To celebrate, yes.* But to celebrate, while intentionally ridiculing your opponent in a public stage is not just unsportsmanly, but irresponsible as it can agitate people and cause violence.*

Perhaps this doesn't apply to the JRU coach as he was probably celebrating on his own, though it was irresponsible to do that if it was while in front of the other team/coaches.

Or take the case of the Arana dance which was consented by Franz, or the unsportsmanly time out by Franz.* Some La Sallites have always argued that asaran and one-upmanship are always the privilege of the winner.* I say true for people in general but it shouldn't be the case for people accorded positions of responsibility (as in coaches, managers, school presidents, etc) nor for people supervised by such responsible people (players, ball boys, cheerleaders).* Why?* Because it sends the wrong signal about sportsmanship.* It also can agitate people into a fight.* That is why there is also a rule among cheerleaders since the 90s to never allow actions or messages that would provoke the other side, which by the way, has time and time again been violated by the La Salle pep squad.



let me re-fresh your selective memory. the year 2002 when you guys won over us, wesley was taunting a fallen cardona and your crowd was jeering and humiliating our players. Did joel banal even reprimand wes for doing so? I dont think so. In fact everyone was enjoying it, including you im sure! Hindi naman pwedeng double standard, diba? You guys have a very strong team this year and the ghost of 2002 just might haunt us again. We'll see what happens!* ;)


Initially, I didn't approve of that action by Wes either. But to refresh your selective memory as well, Wes and Cardona were trash talking each other for the whole game, and when it was explained to me that his finger (not dirty by the way) was the last reprisal for that game-long taunting, I admit I felt good about it. ;D Mind you, no one was taunting the whole DLSU team.

lekiboy
05-20-2007, 05:08 PM
mga repapips...medyo lumalayo na yata tayo sa usapan....

JRU-La Salle Post Game Showdown thread po ito. sa aking palagay ay sa isang bagong thread dapat ang inyong mas malalim na diskusyon... pwede na din yatang isara ito sa para sa part 2 ng kanilang pagttutuos sa FIL OIL...

nahilo na ako sa batuhan dito.. ;D

awat muna...sa UAAP season 70 na ipagpatuloy at baka maubusan.

1979
05-20-2007, 07:18 PM
And they're still at it folks!!!!!!

:D ;D :D ;D :D ;D

nel
05-20-2007, 08:28 PM
Amazing how this thread has stayed active this long. And, as someone pointed out, the JRU supporters don't seem to care about it one way or the other. It's the kibitzers and supporters from other schools that insist on keeping a nonsensical issue alive, particularly by referring to past events that most people have already forgotten.

Folks, it was one incident that can be attributed to the heat of the moment - for both sides. No one was purely to blame, so what's the big deal? It wouldn't have happened without both sides' contributions. Let's leave the past behind. Resurrecting dead issues leaves a smelly mess that sticks to those who persist in digging up the corpse of long-dead issues.

Dark Knight
05-20-2007, 09:58 PM
You guys took this out of proportion.* You cant control peoples emotion. If JRU celebrated the victory like there is no more tomorrow, so be it. Its very difficult to defeat DLSU so beating them is a very big deal. Vanguardia's action is normal* for people like him. Its the DLSU people who got "pikon". They should've let it go. Having the higher school standard, they should be the one to give way.

I dont mind taunting, trash talking and brawls in basketball. It makes the game more exciting IMO. Walang kabuhay buhay pag magkaka ibigan lahat ng players. Just look at the PBA.* ;D ;D

Wingman
05-21-2007, 09:17 AM
Whew. This ain't even a championship game and you guys devoted what, like four pages to a simple post game incident? Hooowee I can't wait for UAAP's next season. The boys are back in town!

Tickets, anyone? It's gonna be a humdinger come July ;D


Whats amazing is that there is not a single one from JRU posting on this thread! ;)

What's more amazing is that ateneans are the ones continuing to post in this topic. Kasali ba sila sa usapan? O nagpapapansin lang. Palagi kasi sila talo sa La Salle. Pathetic.

Jeep
05-21-2007, 09:57 AM
What's more amazing is that ateneans are the ones continuing to post in this topic.* Kasali ba sila sa usapan?* O nagpapapansin lang.* Palagi kasi sila talo sa La Salle.* Pathetic.


paging gameface one and/or any of the mods. i recall one of our rules here regarding flamebaiting and bashing -- technical fouls according to the forum's rules. has this wingman already committed an earlier, similar infraction? if so, then the "two fouls and your out" rule should apply. if he hasn't yet, then this already counts as the first.

Wingman
05-21-2007, 10:06 AM
Flame bait? Where's the bash there? C'mon, state it. I'm just saying the truth. If that is your line, then they should also give warnings to those ateneans who keep on posting in this thread and making a mountain out of a mole hill. That is also flame-bait.

Again, did I bash anyone? If so, state where.

Mateen Cleaves
05-21-2007, 10:31 AM
Cool lang, tayo. :)

I think that there's nothing left to say on this matter. Everyone has had a chance to say their piece. And both DLSU and JRU have had a couple of games under their respective belts already.

It doesn't matter anymore whether anyone is flame-baiting or bashing. Clearly, that's where this thread is going. So before that happens, may I request the mods to just close this thread so that we can have new issues to talk about? :)

5FootCarrot
05-21-2007, 10:43 AM
Teka, hihirit pa ako ;D I really wasn't going to say anything anymore, but...what the heck ;D

I think a lot of the commentary on this incident has come from Ateneans because we were fascinated at how Franz Pumaren and whoever else on the La Salle side reacted to the victory celebration of the JRU coach (and maybe whoever else on that side), in light of how we feel La Salle has treated us whenever they won in the past. I think a post in one of the previous pages stated "don't dish it out if you can't take it," which nicely summarizes my initial thoughts on this matter. However, nel is right and so is Chona the Wondermaid - "pass is pass." ;D What happened hit a little close to home as far as Ateneo fans are concerned, but the issue here is what happened between JRU and La Salle. (That doesn't mean we can't put in our two cents' pesos' worth, though, because this is, after all, a public forum. :P)

Regarding the incident itself, I wasn't there, but from a theoretical standpoint all I can really say is that I agree that winners are free to celebrate as they see fit, within legal limits. Victory celebrations are always going to be hard to swallow for the losing side, but two wrongs don't make a right, so if the winners are celebrating in a manner that makes them look like @$$es, it's best to just leave them to it and save the emotion for the next meeting than to horn in on the act, further exacerbate the matter, and invite discussions like this. (They're fun, though, LOL ;D)

Mang_Roger
05-21-2007, 10:55 AM
Vanguardia is like a chubby kid wayback in grade school who jumps up and down after getting all your "tex". Para sa isang batang coach na nabigyan ng break sa collegiate level at may improvement na napapakita, di mo rin masisi yung tao na magalak ng husto.

Style na rin ni Vanguardia yun (pumping his fist) at isama mo na yung looney tunes na tie niya para makapang-asar din sa kalaban. Imbes na mapikon ka, dapat ganahan ka pang talunin ang JRU para ikaw naman mang-asar kay Vanguardia. Pupusta ako, pikon yun dahil ang taong mahilig mang-asar---pikon!

Teka muna, di ba La Sallista din si Vanguardia?


palagay ko, mapipikon sa atin si ariel vanguardia this season, mang roger...* ;D
we anticipate a hard fighting jru squad this season pero siya pa din ang pikon pag uwi niya...let's see in june 24 - sbc vs jru ( opening game)
knowing frankie, ngiti lang ang ibibigay niya kay ariel - talo o panalo..


Pareng lekiboy, pag nadale tayo ng JRU at nag astang clown si Chubby Boy Vanguardia, gulo yon!

Remember how Gabby Espinas peed on his undies after the first round game against us last season?

Anyway, I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a JRU-La Salle in the Fil-Oil finals. We have a new rivalry! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

oca
05-21-2007, 11:11 AM
Over the weekend may nakausap who saw the game and was still at the vicinity of the Arena nang mag-abot sa parking area ang dalawang coaches...

Opinyon niya, "Nagkapersonalan na."

Well...kung isasara na ang thread na ito... pag nagkita uli itong dalawang team na ito...

Tiyak magkakaroon ng panibagong thread.

Bennie Bangag
05-21-2007, 11:26 AM
tama lang na isara na ang thread na ito kasi nagkakaungkatan na ng mga nakaraang pangyayari na walang kinalaman sa nasabing pangyayari. wala namang problema kung lumikha ng bagong thread, o buksan muli ito kung naisara na nga.

lekiboy
05-21-2007, 11:27 AM
Over the weekend may nakausap who saw the game and was still at the vicinity of the Arena nang mag-abot sa parking area ang dalawang coaches...

Opinyon niya, "Nagkapersonalan na."

Well...kung isasara na ang thread na ito... pag nagkita uli itong dalawang team na ito...

Tiyak magkakaroon ng panibagong thread.



mang roger,
pag fist pumping ok lang..pero wag niya nang gawing engot sarili niya dun at tatamaan siya....hehehehe..kilala naman siguro ni coach vanguardia ang red army..

and to the post of oca, i suggest we start the new thread - "JRU-DLSU: the New Rivalry!!" *;D ;D ;D
Animo Rizal / Animo LaSalle
ang lamig!!!

gameface_one
05-21-2007, 01:04 PM
Ok, with motions posted. We are now closing this thread.