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bigfreeze_bibby
10-23-2006, 07:09 AM
After suffering a semis exit via our arch-rivals Ateneo de Manila in the recently concluded FMC2, what do you think are our chances in this tourney? As I've seen the lineups from partcipating schools, this tourney is surely a catch since I feel all teams are balanced and most of the teams have fielded in their team A plus a couple of elevations done from each school's team B (or training team for that matter).

These are the DLSU game schedules courtesy of GreenArrows as he posted this in AP.com.

November 4 (Saturday)
1:00 pm - 2:00 pm OPENING CEREMONIES
2:00 pm - 4:00 pm ADMU vs. SBC
4:00 pm - 6:00 pm DLSU vs. CSJL
6:00 pm - 8:00 pm SSC vs. UST

November 12 (Sunday)**
4:00 pm - 6:00 pm ADMU vs. DLSU
6:00 pm - 8:00 pm UP vs. JRU
** two exhibition games will be played starting 12PM. ADMU vs. LSGH (Jrs.) then ADMU vs. DLSU (womens)

November 15 (Wednesday)
12:00 pm - 2:00 pm DLSU vs. UST
2:00 pm - 4:00 pm ADMU vs. UE
4:00 pm - 6:00 pm FEU vs. SBC
6:00 pm - 8:00 pm CSJL vs. SSC

November 24 (Friday)
12:00 pm - 2:00 pm JRU vs. UE
2:00 pm - 4:00 pm UP vs. UST
4:00 pm - 6:00 pm FEU vs. DLSU
6:00 pm - 8:00 pm ADMU vs. SSC

December 3 (Sunday)
12:00 pm - 2:00 pm DLSU vs. JRU
2:00 pm - 4:00 pm UE vs. UST
4:00 pm - 6:00 pm CSJL vs. SBC
6:00 pm - 8:00 pm FEU vs. UP

December 13 (Wednesday)
Semifinal Games

December 17 (Sunday)
Championship Game

danny
11-05-2006, 01:58 AM
Off Topic:

Bigfreeze, we need to clarify something before we Bedans become the "accused" in copying a traditional Bedan drumbeat.. Bedans who watched the opening believed that they heard the drumbeat of the 1940's Indian Yell during your game with Letran.

How true is this?

WE need clarification please. Better yet, an acknowledgement that the beat was inspired by our 1940's Indian Yell will do. Trust me. A simple acknowledgement is sufficient for many of us Bedans.

Kid Cubao
11-05-2006, 02:15 PM
i don't think the mod is answerable to that, danny. this is a matter best taken up with the DLSU pep squad. or you can post your sentiments at the "don't copy our cheers and drumbeats" thread at the general discussions forum.

shyboy
11-05-2006, 02:38 PM
OT: While an Eagle was taking a free throw during the 4th quarter, the Atenean in front of me was cheering "One Big Fight!" However, when I looked up the gallery, it was the San Beda drums doing the beat. Really eerie.

nel
11-05-2006, 04:28 PM
Off Topic:

Bigfreeze, we need to clarify something before we Bedans become the* "accused" in copying a traditional Bedan drumbeat..* Bedans who watched the opening believed that they heard the drumbeat of the* 1940's Indian Yell during your game with Letran.

How true is this?

WE need clarification please. Better yet, an acknowledgement that the beat was inspired by our 1940's Indian Yell will do. Trust me. A simple acknowledgement is sufficient for many of us Bedans.

My two cents' worth.

I was a La Sallian sports writer and later on the Sports Ed when La Salle was still in the NCAA, and I made it a point to watch as many of the sports events as possible. I cannot recall any DLSU cheers or chants that we did that were similar to SBC's. If we ever copied any of your cheers or chants, you could be sure that it would already have become an issue at that time, and would have been the cause of some intense heckling duuring the game and a rumble or two after. The inter-school rivalries were serious matters then, especially since many of the NCAA schools were still exclusively male, and copying of cheers was incidiary, to say the least. I do remember that the D-L-S-U Derecho La Salle was very similar to Letran's cheer.

During yesterday's SBC-Ateneo game, we did hear something very similar to one of our chants ending with "One Big Fight!" coming from San Beda, and it apparently is a cross between our chant and Ateneo's "One Big Fight". I can tell you for a certainty that that cheer was never used by San Beda during the NCAA, at least when La Salle was still a member. On the other hand, we used it (the rain chant) even during the pre-martial law era.

green_minded
11-05-2006, 10:18 PM
Off Topic:

Bigfreeze, we need to clarify something before we Bedans become the "accused" in copying a traditional Bedan drumbeat.. Bedans who watched the opening believed that they heard the drumbeat of the 1940's Indian Yell during your game with Letran.

How true is this?

WE need clarification please. Better yet, an acknowledgement that the beat was inspired by our 1940's Indian Yell will do. Trust me. A simple acknowledgement is sufficient for many of us Bedans.

My two cents' worth.

I was a La Sallian sports writer and later on the Sports Ed when La Salle was still in the NCAA, and I made it a point to watch as many of the sports events as possible. I cannot recall any DLSU cheers or chants that we did that were similar to SBC's. If we ever copied any of your cheers or chants, you could be sure that it would already have become an issue at that time, and would have been the cause of some intense heckling duuring the game and a rumble or two after. The inter-school rivalries were serious matters then, especially since many of the NCAA schools were still exclusively male, and copying of cheers was incidiary, to say the least. I do remember that the D-L-S-U Derecho La Salle was very similar to Letran's cheer.

During yesterday's SBC-Ateneo game, we did hear something very similar to one of our chants ending with "One Big Fight!" coming from San Beda, and it apparently is a cross between our chant and Ateneo's "One Big Fight". I can tell you for a certainty that that cheer was never used by San Beda during the NCAA, at least when La Salle was still a member. On the other hand, we used it even during the pre-martial law era.


We do not do the indian yell drum beat. That's a San Beda exclusive since they are the only team in either the NCAA or UAAP that has Indian (meaning U.S. natives and not the Asians) mascots.

But if you are referring to the rain chant, please note La Salle cheerleaders were using the rain chant a month after it was famously sang during the Woodstock Peace Festival in August 1969. LSGH cheerleaders used it in a game against Letran in September 1969. I know, I was at that game when I first heard it. So this is not heresay but first hand witness testimony as to its use. The only difference then, as compared to how it is cheered now, we did not add ANIMO LA SALLE at the end of each chant. What we did was bang on bells, whistles, tin cans and other noise makers we could get our hands on to create the festive noise making after every chant. Just like it was done in Woodtsock. It was only when we joined the UAAP was ANIMO LA SALLE added to the end of each chant to replace the noise making. -- GreenArrows

bigfreeze_bibby
11-06-2006, 07:22 AM
Folks, pardon my ignorance in this cheering concern but are we talking here of the woooooh...Animo La Salle cheer just like the wooooh...Go San Beda Fight? Yun yung nakita kong parehas na cheer for San Beda and La Salle as far as last Saturday's game is concerned.

Thanks green_minded for posting the reply of GA in archerpride.

LION
11-06-2006, 08:10 AM
OT:* While an Eagle was taking a free throw during the 4th quarter, the Atenean in front of me was cheering "One Big Fight!"* However, when I looked up the gallery, it was the San Beda drums doing the beat.* Really eerie.


Mukhang nakakalito na. :)

danny
11-06-2006, 10:47 AM
Indian Yell brumbeat muna.

So there was no Indian Yell drumbeat during the game with Letran?

danny
11-06-2006, 02:39 PM
My apologies. Discussions regarding the cheers will be made in the appropriate thread. :D

freak
11-06-2006, 10:49 PM
But if you are referring to the rain chant, please note La Salle cheerleaders were using the rain chant a month after it was famously sang during the Woodstock Peace Festival in August 1969. LSGH cheerleaders used it in a game against Letran in September 1969. I know, I was at that game when I first heard it. So this is not heresay but first hand witness testimony as to its use. The only difference then, as compared to how it is cheered now, we did not add ANIMO LA SALLE at the end of each chant. What we did was bang on bells, whistles, tin cans and other noise makers we could get our hands on to create the festive noise making after every chant. Just like it was done in Woodtsock. It was only when we joined the UAAP was ANIMO LA SALLE added to the end of each chant to replace the noise making. -- GreenArrows


Kala ko ikaw talaga yung naka witness nun, green_minded.. hehe.. ang tagal na noon ah! ;D

Dumbledore
11-07-2006, 07:00 PM
Folks, pardon my ignorance in this cheering concern but are we talking here of the woooooh...Animo La Salle cheer just like the wooooh...Go San Beda Fight? Yun yung nakita kong parehas na cheer for San Beda and La Salle as far as last Saturday's game is concerned.

Thanks green_minded for posting the reply of GA in archerpride.



I do not also know cheering history but the 'wooooh...Animo La Salle or Go San Beda fight' chant is frequently used by any NCAA collegiate cheering squad. I, myself, do not know the school which started such cheer.

shyboy
11-13-2006, 09:02 AM
La Salle won over Ateneo yesterday, 69-58.

Animo La Salle!

jembengzon
11-13-2006, 09:20 AM
La Salle won over Ateneo yesterday, 69-58.

Animo La Salle!


congrats to dlsu for a well-played game. you will be a force next season to reckon with.

bigfreeze_bibby
11-13-2006, 09:29 AM
Madami pa ring lapses sa depensa kahapon. Nagkataon lang na nag-click ang press nung 3rd quarter saka masama talaga laro ni Arao. Mas mabuti pa siguro na binabad na lang si Baldos sa poste kesa pinaglaro si Arao. JV was just sinking most of his shots and oozing with confidence yesterday. Ilad and Barua provided the fireman's role yesterday by scoring crucial baskets to douse the Ateneo run. OJ's defensive steals in the height of the pressure blitzkrieg were also a big help to the team's cause.

Another tough game is waiting us come Wednesday against the reigning UAAP champs, UST.

green_minded
11-13-2006, 09:44 AM
Another tough game is waiting us come Wednesday against the reigning UAAP champs, UST.

Question would be...since UST has pbl players at Kettlecorn...will they play in this game?

Kid Cubao
11-13-2006, 09:50 AM
great game by la salle. the archers attacked ateneo's tentativeness at the inbound plays and made six straight points in a matter of seconds in the 3rd quarter. ang sakit nung nangyari yun. we never led again after that.

ang asim pa rin maglaro ni jv casio, walanghiya talaga. brian ilad had a good endgame as well by securing la salle's victory in the last minutes. congratulations guys.

regarding the UST tigers now with kettlecorn, di ko alam kung ano ang patakaran dyan kung pwede maglaro sa homegrown cup. sa ateneo kasi, ang mga naglalaro lang sa PBL ay sina macky at doug, na tapos na sa kanilang UAAP career.

brian
11-13-2006, 11:31 AM
oo nga , dun nadiskaril ang ateneo sa 6 straight points from that press....great game all in all

shyboy
11-13-2006, 12:02 PM
Question would be...since UST has pbl players at Kettlecorn...will they play in this game?


The core UAAP team of UST except Evangelista is in the lineup for the Homegrown Cup. I read somewhere the games are scheduled to avoid any conflict with the PBL. So most probably, Duncil and co. will play for UST this Wednesday.

gfy
11-13-2006, 07:40 PM
UST played against SSC last time with their UAAP lineup(even Evangelista) except for Ababou who just came back from the USA. They lost by 2 points I think because Pido didn't take the game seriously, complaining about the calls all the time. But I am sure they would want to beat DLSU to prove their championship wasn't a fluke. I am eagerly waiting for the Ilad-Cruz boxing match Part II ;D.

brian
11-13-2006, 08:03 PM
UST played against SSC last time with their UAAP lineup(even Evangelista) except for Ababou who just came back from the USA. They lost by 2 points I think because Pido didn't take the game seriously, complaining about the calls all the time. But I am sure they would want to beat DLSU to prove their championship wasn't a fluke. I am eagerly waiting for the Ilad-Cruz boxing match Part II* ;D.


gfy,

and when has pido taken a game seriously? even during the finals against your squad, akala mo hindi siya seryoso..maybe yun ang style niya, kunwari he doesn't really expect anything from his guys...pero deep inside malay mo at lumuluha din siya pag talo he he!

gfy
11-13-2006, 10:43 PM
Brian - I know that Pido was reported to say that his style is to let his players do what they do best but the "bad calls" made them lose their focus in the 4th quarter. They including Pido were then just laughing after every call by the referees. I was even surprised by this behavior. Even Mrs. Francisco said something like "huwag na ba natin siputin yun next game dahil sa bad calls" to Pido. I hope she was kidding.

bigfreeze_bibby
11-14-2006, 07:04 AM
Every coach has his own strategy during off season tourneys but I do hope this doesn't back fire to Pido during the real season or when the game matters the most to his team. I remember during their CCL encounter with JRU, bad calls also ruined their game "mojo" and eventually lost focus to get eliminated in the first round (add to that a couple of ejections during the game).

For DLSU, we should take these good chances in meeting stronger teams because this is the only time of the year wherein we have this opportunity to meet team A rosters from different schools unlike in FMC2 wherein we face less competition and less quality teams (with the exception of Ateneo B of course).

brian
11-15-2006, 12:22 AM
bad calls are just part of each and every game....the remaining question is, in who's favor? each team should learn to adjust to the calls of the referee..it's no excuse to stop trying....it's always a factor though >:(

when the going gets tough, the taft boys gets going he he!

animo la salle!!!!

bigfreeze_bibby
11-15-2006, 01:50 PM
DLSU beats UST 73-59. Game news to follow since I wasn't able to watch the game due to work. Ang work talaga nakakasira sa panonood ng basketball hehehe.

brian
11-15-2006, 02:11 PM
<<<<<<---------CONGRATS GREEN ARCHERS...ANIMO LA SALLE!!------<<<<

1979
11-15-2006, 09:27 PM
Cholo Villanueva led the Archers from start to finish. Post defense on Jervy Cruz was remarkable, as he was never able to get into his comfort zone. Kish Co, Ilad and JWalsh did a great job on him. JV Casio and OJ Cua had great games too, to make up for the "average" showing of Ty Tang and Malabes. Rico was simply awesome in this game, again! Rebounding and blocked shots were all his. All this with Marko unable to play due to an ankle injury.

23 year old Jojo Duncil was frustrated with the phalanx of defenders threwn at him, leading to a wayward elbow to rookie Simon Atkins' nose.

Pido simply was not able to react. DLSU simply knew what to do, at the right time. We kept running the same offensive play, with the same results, time and again.

:)

green_minded
11-15-2006, 11:03 PM
So far, bagsak ang laro ni Simon Atkins. Very disappointing. :-\

nel
11-16-2006, 07:33 AM
I wouldn't worry about Simon. He's only in his first year with the team under Franz's system. Transitioning from high school to top flight college ball takes some adjusting. When UAAP 70 starts next year, I expect him to be able to be a solid backup to TY. He's already shown flashes of what he can do, and when he becomes more familiar with the system and gains confidence with his role within the team, he'll do much better. There's a lot of upside with Atkins.

brian
11-16-2006, 12:12 PM
correct, let's not forget how ty started out playing for the green archers..look at him now, fully blossomed and arguably the best pointguard in the uaap when season 70 begins...

oca
11-16-2006, 12:58 PM
So far, bagsak ang laro ni Simon Atkins. Very disappointing.* :-\


I think the expectations on the kid is just unreasonably high.

Konting unawa naman....

Coming off the juniors, no tournament play for over a long period of time, just 3 games into the Homegrown and what do we want from him....

This kid has talent , pero work-in-process pa yan...at mahabang W-I-P.

I have seen a good amount of Junior HARDCORE games during the time of Atkins at Zobel. In the few games he actually played against the NCAA teams, he was actually outplayed! Kampeon pa sila ng UAAP nyan!

If Zobel's title gave glitter to Atkins name, I say stop and consider this-- That Zobel UAAP champion team never won a game against the top 3 teams of the NCAA- San Sebastian anchored by Salamat, San Beda led by Hermida and PCU whose top gunner I saw play for the Green Archers in the Nike-FMC last summer.

Pero may laro ang bata... just don't believe he will be a major contributor this early.

But since he has a full 5-year eligibility... you all can afford to be patient.

brian
11-16-2006, 03:18 PM
very true.....and let's all consider this, atkins has been highly recruited by several uaap schools but still opted to join the archers despite the suspension..

this says a lot about the kid's dedication to our school...we should at least reciprocate accordingly..

as oca has stated, it's only been three games...wala pa sa full potential ang "lahat" ng mga players ng la salle.

green_minded
11-18-2006, 07:53 AM
correct, let's not forget how ty started out playing for the green archers..look at him now, fully blossomed and arguably the best pointguard in the uaap when season 70 begins...

So far in this tourney, sad to say, may kaba pa rin si TY as evidenced by errors and missed shots. If Casio is sent in, better results come. 8)

nel
11-18-2006, 08:16 AM
correct, let's not forget how ty started out playing for the green archers..look at him now, fully blossomed and arguably the best pointguard in the uaap when season 70 begins...

So far in this tourney, sad to say, may kaba pa rin si TY as evidenced by errors and missed shots. If Casio is sent in, better results come.* 8)

Rather than kaba, I'd say that TY is simply rusty. It's been a long layoff from top-notch competition for the entire team, and even though they practice regularly, there's no substitute for actual tournament games against good teams. As Franz says, they're still a long way from being UAAP-ready. Anyway, there's a long way to go before the start of the season, and the coaches don't want to burn our players out. Lest we forget, they also have to get good grades to stay on the team under Franz's rules.

The season's more than half a year away. Let's not pressure the boys and just enjoy the game. If we win, great. If we lose, remember that we're after the bigger trophy.

brian
11-18-2006, 09:23 AM
correct, let's not forget how ty started out playing for the green archers..look at him now, fully blossomed and arguably the best pointguard in the uaap when season 70 begins...

So far in this tourney, sad to say, may kaba pa rin si TY as evidenced by errors and missed shots. If Casio is sent in, better results come.* 8)


i beg to differ, ty tang simply wasn't making his shots..maybe due to rust (as nel pointed out)..but he kept on taking the ones given him..meaning wala syang kaba, only missing his shots..

nel
11-18-2006, 05:24 PM
I'm not worried about TY. It's his last playing year for the Archers, and he accepts the role of a team leader. TY has always been a never-say-die kind of guy. Look at how he persevered even after the brickbats thrown at him during his first 2 years. Last year, he emerged as one of the best and headiest point guards in the UAAP. In the last PBL tournament, he joined Teletech in the middle of the tournament, and once he shook of the rust due to inactivity, quickly became the most trusted PG of Coach Codinera. TY has developed a lot of confidence when Coach Franz gave him the role of first string PG. He's never looked back since.

TY will be fine. I expect him to be even more motivated as one of the leaders of the Archers next year. He's one of the guys I'd want with the ball in his hands with the game on the line with seconds left on the game clock. TY will know what to do with the rock.

jembengzon
11-18-2006, 05:53 PM
i think too much is expected out of atkins or tang at this stage. as what's been pointed out, tang is still shaking off the rust, but once the physical aspect and the conditioning comes back, the sharpness will be there. he's never lost his smarts, and it will all sync when the team playes on the same page, building up momentum up to the season and onwards. pumaren will never allow his team to peak too early, and uses the off-season to develop also the intangibles needed during crunch time.

atkins should be compared to the development of others during their first seasons, not against his play in high school. and from what i see, he's developing quite nicely. this isthe first time he's playing against seasoned guards, so his being taken to school on certain occasions is expected. but he's a quick learner and a fighter, so i expect his decision-making to be a lot crisper come season 70.

brian
11-18-2006, 07:19 PM
i think too much is expected out of atkins or t@ng at this stage.* as what's been pointed out, t@ng is still shaking off the rust, but once the physical aspect and the conditioning comes back, the sharpness will be there.* he's never lost his smarts, and it will all sync when the team playes on the same page, building up momentum up to the season and onwards.* pumaren will never allow his team* to peak too early, and uses the off-season to develop also the intangibles needed during crunch time.

atkins should be compared to the development of others during their first seasons, not against his play in high school.* and from what i see, he's developing quite nicely.* *this isthe first time he's playing against seasoned guards, so his being taken to school on certain occasions is expected.* but he's a quick learner and a fighter,* *so i expect his decision-making to be a lot crisper come season 70.


i agree..well, you of all people should know, i'd call macky escolana's number on this one... look at him, a not so heralded player in highschool, who with his passion and dedication has come out to become a premiere point guard out of the uaap..

pana-panahon lang yan....let's all give our players sufficient time to develop their skills :D

Wingman
11-18-2006, 08:34 PM
I don't think bagsak ang laro ni Simon at this point. When TY was in his freshman year I remember kinakabahan tayo na baka hindi niya maitawid ng halfcourt line ang bola. That isn't the case for Simon. Simon has control and I can sense that he will develop in time. Remember, a good PG must look to pass first before shooting and I think that is what Simon is doing right now.

Great win over Ateneo. Kahit na "lasalista lang tayo" as what some smart user posted at BEN, eh we've had their number for oh so many years now, with the exception of 2002 and 1986-1988. We've had them at our mercy for 17 out of 21 years.

Not bad, right? :)

brian
11-18-2006, 11:08 PM
it actually bemuses me that despite the fact that our team has been winning ( 3 games in a row na) some still find time to complain about certain players' shortcomings and whatsoever..

the fact is, the green archers have been playing and winning as a team...and if they aren't, then we should be concerned..imho

so much so for this... our next game will be against the feu tams and the way we've been playing, seems like we'll be ok... but on the other hand, feu has been showing great poise too..

flsfnoeraekadad
11-18-2006, 11:24 PM
Let's not demand much from the team. They are doing their jobs and it has been converted to wins. Let them save some for themselves for the big dance next year. Isang taon din tayo hindi nakaranas ng ganitong uri ng televised at intense games. The double digit wins over Ateneo and UST were signs that the team is really fast in recovering to full strength. They have been executing plays well, defending and most especially putting points on the board when the situation needed for them to score. We can't ask more from the team. They have been under the constant stalking and bashing of "the others", rigorous practices and these wins. I know adjustments should be made, pero you can't ask anymore from the Archers team. Hardworking, excellent, and unselfish people make up this squad. These people have been molded by La Salle to represent our alma mater and I'm excited for the team.

Wag na kayong makinig sa mga excuses nila dahil hindi naman mababago yung score, mas importante yung progress ng team natin. Simon's not that bad either. He's been a good back-up PG for TY as of now kahit di sya masyadong productive in terms of points. He'll still learn a lot more from TY and from Coach Franz who was a point guard himself. Don't push too much expectations to Simon. Let the game come to him. First year pa lang sya. Kahit kay Marko din minsan masyado natin syang binibigyan ng madaming expectations and I think we should just let him work his ass off para hindi sya masyado ma-pressure. Our coaches put them there because they know that these people can do the things needed. Let's not burden them with pressure. Let's be constructive of how we want to see these players strut their stuff on the hardcourt and in school.

As for the whole team, there is still work to do pero nararamdaman ko na andun na sila sa point na medyo malapit-lapit na sila ng konti sa gusto nilang results as a team saka yung sa individual efforts. Something about 65-70 percent full strength. Let's continue supporting the Archers win or lose. Great work but there's still a greater challenge ahead.

Green White FIGHT!

flsfnoeraekadad
11-18-2006, 11:42 PM
Great win over Ateneo. Kahit na "lasalista lang tayo" as what some smart user posted at BEN
Lamig na naman ah. Lumalakas na naman ang hangin nila. Hahahaha!

Fried Green Tomato
11-19-2006, 04:56 AM
Atkins and our other players are doing just fine.

There was a time when we've been critical of ty tang. We went through his horrible 1st & even 2nd year in the uaap and some of just were calling for ouster in the team. But we were proven wrong.

Eventhough some are still disappointed with simon's performance, i do not hear any lasallians severely complaining or worried about his ability and ball handling skill. When ty was at this stage, we were worried if he would ever get the ball pass the halfcourt. And with that as a barometer, we have nothing to worry about simon.

When it comes to the developement of our players, just trust franz' instinct. He was able to develop tang to a better and reliable pointguard and i'm sure he knows what he's doing.

For the past 2 games (against ateneo & ust) ty tang is not playing his old reliable self but i'm not complaining. Let's be patient with our players. The uaap season is still a good 8 months away and experience gained on off-season uaap tournaments are just good for the learning process of our players.

Let's just watch them play, worry a little and enjoy.

bigfreeze_bibby
11-20-2006, 07:13 AM
The game against FEU will also be a tough test for us. From what I've seen, this FEU team is also good. Tall and lanky players who can run up and down the court and has good court sense as well. I think we can beat them by out hustling them especially in the rebounding department and our perimeter game clicking on all cylinders.

nel
11-20-2006, 09:52 AM
This FEU team follows the prototype of previous teams that started with the recruitment of Arwind, Yabut, et al - tall, athletic, with good range, and loaded with streetball basketball smarts. We're probably looking at the Tams of season 70 already, so this should be a good test of how we will match up with them next year. I'm not sure about the coaching staff, though. Is it still Flores or will it be Capacio next year?

MaRz
11-20-2006, 03:46 PM
i think its Glen Capacio who is calling the shots for FEU..

brian
11-20-2006, 06:36 PM
i think its Glen Capacio who is calling the shots for FEU..


but who's going to call the shots next year? i did read that bert flores is staying as coach..but it still isn't clear if it's as head coach..

gfy
11-20-2006, 07:25 PM
Reliable sources told me that Capacio is now the FEU coach. They also told me the real story about Mangahas and Adolfo but I couldn't divulge it at this time. They also have recruits from their HS and elsewhere who might be included in their lineup next year. Their hot shooter, Cawaling, who played in the FMC2 is still in HS so he was not included in this Homegrown Cup.

Hooplover
11-21-2006, 03:06 AM
Reliable sources told me that Capacio is now the FEU coach. They also told me the real story about Mangahas and Adolfo but I couldn't divulge it at this time. They also have recruits from their HS and elsewhere who might be included in their lineup next year. Their hot shooter, Cawaling, who played in the FMC2 is still in HS so he was not included in this Homegrown Cup.
*gfy,since you are well updated on the Tams,who is their 6'8 recruit?where did he came from?is he playing in the homegrown cup?and about Cawaling,is he the same guy once featured in THE SUN newspaper as a promising 6'3 15 years old?and how about their new recruits,i'm quite interested because FEU never ceased to impress me as far as discovering and recruiting is concerned.It seems they have scouts in every basketball hotbed in the country.

gfy
11-21-2006, 06:11 AM
^^ Not really. Cawaling I think is only 17 years old. The 6'8" recruit is a project (he tried out at Ateneo early this year) and is bulking up.

flsfnoeraekadad
11-24-2006, 10:31 PM
The game earlier was just a rampage.

The opponents were virtually crushed at any angle available to the analyst.

gfy
11-25-2006, 01:35 AM
^^ That should include your David64. It was the first time most of the FEU guys experienced your "nightmare" press and a lot of points were given up as a result of turnovers. It also did not help being down 11-0 at the start. But don't celebrate yet. UE remains the team to beat with their complete lineup. Their PBL players, especially Gregorio, are much improved. James Martinez is becoming a shooter more consistent than Casio or T@ng. And they have a banger in Fampulme to take care of Ilad. And their coach knows the press well.

Kid Cubao
11-25-2006, 07:14 AM
no way UE will get past DLSU. the green archers are the most driven, determined team in the tournament. while other teams are using the homegrown cup to roadtest their season 70 candidates, la salle entered the tournament clearly with one mission in mind, and that is to obliterate the competition. kaya naman nila--the team is an interesting mix of veterans and newcomers and they are slowly getting the hang of playing together.

gfy
11-25-2006, 07:50 AM
^^ You didn't watch the UE-JRU game? Everybody was there on the UE bench except Borboran. After posting a huge lead with their first 5, they played their second unit the rest of the game. And UE would want to add even another so-so championship plus 100k for Christmas.

Wingman
11-25-2006, 08:08 AM
^^^Well at least they have a championship -- even if it is only "so-so".

brian
11-25-2006, 12:50 PM
no way UE will get past DLSU. the green archers are the most driven, determined team in the tournament. while other teams are using the homegrown cup to roadtest their season 70 candidates, la salle entered the tournament clearly with one mission in mind, and that is to obliterate the competition. kaya naman nila--the team is an interesting mix of veterans and newcomers and they are slowly getting the hang of playing together.


i hope so he he!

brian
11-25-2006, 12:52 PM
^^ You didn't watch the UE-JRU game? Everybody was there on the UE bench except Borboran. After posting a huge lead with their first 5, they played their second unit the rest of the game. And UE would want to add even another so-so championship plus 100k for Christmas.


gfy,

sabihin mo nalang na you hope ue wins he he!...well, we all know how different it could be in actual games...as a matter of fact, ue has been the team to beat for quite some time now...maski nung panahon pa nina james gang and the yap este james yap and the gang..

glock23
11-25-2006, 01:11 PM
right now DLSU is the hungrier team and there is no stopping us from lording it over everyone in this tournament, UE included. GFY, your side has been making excuses ever since your defeat to the green archers saying that we are the only ones taking this thing seriously. i dont know what they teach you in your school but we were taught to be competitors and achievers in whatever we do. when it comes to competing one must strive to win or else why bother competing at all. All i hear from you guys are excuses that your team has had to many tournaments this year or that they have to hit the books etc. If thats really the case then just back out! tell your tribe to learn to take defeat gallantly, salute the better team and be like gentlemen. NO EXCUSES!!!

bluebruiser90
11-25-2006, 03:23 PM
I would like to believe that Ateneo is taking this tournament seriously. They should.* If it didn't then there's no sense in competing.* They just lost to better motivated and better prepared teams. No excuses.* Regardless of how the team would like to treat the Homegrown Cup and any tournament as a test drive comp to try new pieces, the sting of a loss will always be felt. I also felt that La Salle will be the favorites to win this comp, firstly they do have the pieces to match up with the other heralded teams, second, the kinks caused by their lay-off has been shaken off to a certain degree and their system tweaked further after the FMC II tourney and third, they are really hungry to prove their worth against this year's best collegiate teams.* Also, La Salle, just like any team in the UAAP or NCAA would naturally want* to jump start their build up for the next season on a high note and winning the Homegrown Cup is as good as any opportunity that may be available. I wouldn't mind Ateneo winning it.* * *

gfy
11-25-2006, 06:22 PM
I don't make excuses. I just call them as I see them. Even your David64 posted in your site that FEU wouldn't be a pushover. FEU players will learn from their loss to the Archers. As far as UE is concerned and if they field a complete lineup, it would indeed be an interesting match. They are a little weak in the 1 and 2 (except Marcy and James) but the other guards, Bandaying, Reyes and Zamar, are developing nicely. I just hope that in the event you lose to UE you will not say that your team is only at 75% of its potential.* ;) As far as Ateneo is concerned, we are only at 30% of our potential. >:(

brian
11-25-2006, 06:42 PM
I would like to believe that Ateneo is taking this tournament seriously. They should.* If it didn't then there's no sense in competing.* They just lost to better motivated and better prepared teams. No excuses.* Regardless of how the team would like to treat the Homegrown Cup and any tournament as a test drive comp to try new pieces, the sting of a loss will always be felt. I also felt that La Salle will be the favorites to win this comp, firstly they do have the pieces to match up with the other heralded teams, second, the kinks caused by their lay-off has been shaken off to a certain degree and their system tweaked further after the FMC II tourney and third, they are really hungry to prove their worth against this year's best collegiate teams.* Also, La Salle, just like any team in the UAAP or NCAA would naturally want* to jump start their build up for the next season on a high note and winning the Homegrown Cup is as good as any opportunity that may be available. I wouldn't mind Ateneo winning it.* * *


i agree..i believe it's how it should be and it must always remain this way..si gfy lang naman ang exception to the rule eh ha ha..

brian
11-25-2006, 06:50 PM
I don't make excuses. I just call them as I see them. Even your David64 posted in your site that FEU wouldn't be a pushover. FEU players will learn from their loss to the Archers. As far as UE is concerned and if they field a complete lineup, it would indeed be an interesting match. They are a little weak in the 1 and 2 (except Marcy and James) but the other guards, Bandaying, Reyes and Zamar, are developing nicely. I just hope that in the event you lose to UE you will not say that your team is only at 75% of its potential.* ;) As far as Ateneo is concerned, we are only at 30% of our potential. >:(


mayroon ka bang narinig na di namin sineseryoso ung game ng natalo ng team b mo kami? ala naman di ba?....as of late, we've been quite impressive, however, i believe we could still be better. tama si bluebreuiser, perhaps the factor which has led us to play this way is our hunger to prove our worth against the other collegiate teams..

in a way, pinasasaya rin siguro kaming nagaabang sa kanilang pagbabalik...the team probably knows how much we miss them..

when you say that "hindi sineseryoso ng teams ang homegrown cup" that is disrespecting the game..

bchoter
11-25-2006, 06:58 PM
In the past even DLSU took these offseason games lightly. Pati nga PBL ginagawa lang preparatory stage for the UAAP. Even GreenArrows said something similar in PEX.

brian
11-25-2006, 07:23 PM
perhaps, but our main goal was still to win.....every off season game/tournament in fact is a preparatory stage for the upcoming uaap and winning in these off season leagues/games could be a peek on how we'd fare when the uaap comes..

there is no reason at all not to give your all...maybe experiment a little etc but the attitude should be there..

i have yet to hear a coach or player claim that they weren't serious in game....siguro tayo as spectators may perceive otherswise

gfy
11-25-2006, 09:53 PM
Hoy Brian I never said "di namin sineseryo ang Homegrown Cup". Paki cite nga yun post ko kasi medyo malilimutin na ako. Pero serious ako na we are only at 30% of our potential as of today November 25, 2006 10:00 pm. :D I didn't even make any comment when our team B beat your Archers. Anyway, I am looking forward to this DLSU - UE match.

brian
11-25-2006, 10:11 PM
gfy,

i did recall you saying something to that effect, if i am mistaken, my apologies.. ..

wag high blood, yun puso mo he he!

Wingman
11-26-2006, 12:43 AM
I think Ateneo is already at 100%. Look at Ford Arao, he is playing true to his potential.

gfy
11-26-2006, 06:11 AM
^^ Kaw naman. FYI Arao did very well in the Baste-Ateneo game. Don't worry. He'll be at 110% come next season.

Brian - I've never been a sourgraper. And I don't make excuses.

Fried Green Tomato
11-26-2006, 06:32 AM
Since La Salle's suspension and until we play our next uaap game (hopefully next season), our motivation (plan) is somewhat different from the past preparatory tournaments that la salle joined. For obvious reason, the team is hungry of high-quality ballgames after being deprived of the last uaap basketball season and whether other teams treat an off-season tournament half-heartedly or not is no longer our problem. Whatever maybe their purpose for joining the tournament is dependent on what they want to achieve but i believe that no team would play in the court without the intention of winning the game. No basketball coach, no matter how stupid he is, would like to inject a losing tradition in the minds of his players.

But admittedly, the motivation is somewhat different come uaap time. La Salle's goal for joining this tournament is of course to win but we are also ready to accept that defeat is also a possibility. One good thing brought out by the suspension is that we were able to reflect on a weakness rarely seen because of our winning tradition... instilling a winning attitude to the players.

Some may have the perception that la salle is so serious and eager to win against all their opponents but when you really think of it, that should be the right attitude. Instilling a winning attitude to the players is the intangible factor one learns by joining the off-season tournaments... after all, they are going to meet the same people come uaap time. Simply, it's a mental thing; players with winning attitude are easier to motivate than those players experiencing defeat after defeat.

La Salle's approach going to season 70 is way way different from how we developed our teams before. There's a need to adjust our plan and that's what we're doing. Some would say we're too serious, that's fine with us. Afterall, different teams have different ways of motivating their players. It's still a very long journey and we expect other teams to learn from their mistakes and adjust as well.

bigfreeze_bibby
11-26-2006, 10:41 AM
During our last game against UE, which is a practice game, nahirapan tayo in that game although we won by 1 point. Wala pa yung mga main players nila nun so I see that UE is a serious opponent for us and it will be a good match to see. Don't worry gfy, we will prepare for them and if ever we lose, we will definitely treat those as lessons/gaps to address come next year.

glock23
11-26-2006, 01:51 PM
gfy, so your team is only playing at 30% of their capabilities? that is pure horse cr@p! everytime there is a lasalle vs ateneo game todo bigay ang ang lahat. this is all for pride man. alisin nyo na kasi yung "win or lose its the school we choose" na motto. it just instills the sourgraping and losing attitude in your team. kaya di lumalaban dahil at the end of the game, they know that kung talo man sila, the community will brainwash them into thinking, ok lang yan atenista ka naman. what a losers attitude! OH, by the way how is your "great" japeth aguilar doing? Laki na siguro ng gastos ng handler ni jap wag lang ma buko na pinaalis para walang "problema" ;D

gfy
11-26-2006, 09:39 PM
Glock23 - Naniniwala ka naman sa lahat na sinasabi ko. Actually we're at 45% as of today* :D. Nag-improved na. Kanina sa Ultra, UST, with only Cruz, Gile and Marquez from team A and 6 other guys from team B, beat San Beda. Only Ekwe, Aljamal and Escobal didn't play. Angeles doesn't have any eligibilty left although he didn't play as well. UE beat FEU by 6 points. UE played their first 5 sparingly but when they did at the start of the second half, they scored a net 12 points in just about 4 minutes of play. They didn't really press FEU that much and FEU players showed they could score if only they could bring the ball to their front court* ;). Several of them are good slashers. I was told they gave up 31 turnover points in their DLSU game.

Bigfreeze - The reason why UE has an advantage over your team is because I don't think you could press them like you did to FEU. And they could press you with Borboran and Gregorio helping out. Rebounding UE has a slight edge and they have several shooters. The jumpers of Borboran, Espiritu, Gregorio, Canizares and even Thiele were virtually impossible to block. Plus they have Marcy and James. Even their new guards could shoot the treys like Bandaying. And I forgot about that guy Lee from Baste who's a tall guard and could shoot as well although he didn't play today. At one time, they had Canizares, Borboran, Espiritu, Gregorio and Marcy on the court. How could you play pressing defense on these very tall guys? One weakness is they are a little slow on defense so a slashing Villanueva will score a lot of points off them.

brian
11-27-2006, 12:35 AM
gfy,

but you forget, we have rejan lee ;D

seriously now.. you speak of so many good ue players..my point, as if naman we have none of our own ha ha!

we've have battled this ue team and have prevailed in the past. the difference now is we don't have joseph yeo, on the other hand, they are also missing bonbon custodio...

i am not saying that we surely are to win but only that it will be a great game....

gfy
11-27-2006, 06:18 AM
^^ I said earlier that you are not that quick anymore without Yeo and Arana. So no more a lot of fastbreak points. Would you believe that UE scored several fastbreak points vs. the already fast FEU team? Those guys - Gregorio, Canizares and Borboran can really dribble and run. Yes it's going to be a good game. I understand that you will meet UE on Dec. 13 which is the semis. The top 2 teams in the same bracket will fight for the semis. No crossovers.

green_minded
11-27-2006, 07:06 AM
I understand that you will meet UE on Dec. 13 which is the semis. The top 2 teams in the same bracket will fight for the semis. No crossovers.

...and I believe that this IS the Finals and not the real Finals. ;)

brian
11-27-2006, 08:17 AM
^^ I said earlier that you are not that quick anymore without Yeo and Arana. So no more a lot of fastbreak points. Would you believe that UE scored several fastbreak points vs. the already fast FEU team? Those guys - Gregorio, Canizares and Borboran can really dribble and run. Yes it's going to be a good game. I understand that you will meet UE on Dec. 13 which is the semis. The top 2 teams in the same bracket will fight for the semis. No crossovers.


yes i believe that ue scored several fastbreak points against the already fast feu team, but would you believe that we led by 46 at one point in our game against the already fast feu team and finished ahead by 27 at the final buzzer...ilan ba ang lamang ng ue 6 lang ata eh..so would you believe that we also scored a lot of fast break points against the already fast feu tamaraws...tit for tat

but lets agree that it would be a great match......magkaiba lang tayo ng kinakampihan ha ha!

nel
11-27-2006, 08:44 AM
While the game is a toss up, I'd look at the past track record of the Warriors against DLSU. Save for that disputed loss that was overturned, I don't remember UE having much success against us. Franz has always emphasized an opportunistic fastbreaking offense anchored on the pressure defense, which can cause turnovers in bunches.

UE can run and shoot effectively when defenses are not as tight; let's wait and see what they can do against the Archers. I'm sure Dindo will prepare them well.

brian
11-27-2006, 09:02 AM
i believe it all boils down to execution, and both teams have been executing pretty well their last couple of matches..

chinky_06
11-27-2006, 11:21 AM
I've seen the UE team play and they are a force to reckon with. Dami nilang big guys. Let us not forget the other players in their team such as Fampulme and Etrone who are shooters. Fampulme is a big man who can shoot, and a force inside. Etrone is a shooter. Hope DLSU is not underestimating UE... I hate to see La Salle lose to the Warriors... I am such a sore loser pa naman... hahaha! Thpugh I am also hoping for a DLSU-UE finals!!! a prelude to UAAP? ;D



ANIMO LA SALLE! from DLS HSC

GHRanger
11-27-2006, 12:14 PM
Let's not also forget that the Archers also have a rotation of tall players - Jwalsh, Brian, Rico, Marko (if he's playing), we also have a tall guards/forwards in Badeer, OJ, PJ, Kish.* We also have a reliable set of shooters/slashers -- Rico, Badeer, OJ, Poch, JVee.* As well as a very good PG rotation - JVee, TY, Poch and Simon.

With all of these cancelling out, the key issues here would be:
1. Who breaks the press first.
2. Who enforces the most terrifying press.
3. Who can make opportunities for other players.
4. Who has the better Conditioning and Athleticism.

This will be a good test for the Archers because they will be able to iron out the kinks in our armor.* There are two teams that I like to see the archers play against, one is NU - because for some reason they have consistently found a way to break the press and UE - the other team that plays the same trapping defense.* Playing against UE will be a win win situation for us in preparation for the UAAP.* -- same goes for UE.

I think the key players for this game will be the guards -- Breaking the press, passing, creating opportunities.* Expect a methodical, intense and thinking game - as well as a game full of foul troubled players.* :D.* And as history has proven, expect no quarters from the two brothers.

Good luck.

gfy
11-27-2006, 12:39 PM
Brian - I was trying to say that UE has 2-3 tall players who can perform the fastbreak much like what Maierhofer does for you. UE didn't seem to want to show a lot of this yesterday. The loss of Yeo and Arana leaves only Cholo as the fearless slasher in your lineup. If the new guards of UE perform well as they have shown they can do, then they can defend well against the fastbreak and help Marcy and James in their own fastbreak as well. Both JV/Tyrone and Marcy/James may cancel each other out. This brings us to the small forward/shooting guard/power forward comparison. Here UE I think has the height and experience and a little edge in shooting. Malabes, Barua and OJ shouldn't have an off-day for you to keep in step with UE. Your smaller small forwards have to hustle and make some steals off the taller UE guys.

brian
11-27-2006, 01:05 PM
Brian - I was trying to say that UE has 2-3 tall players who can perform the fastbreak much like what Maierhofer does for you. UE didn't seem to want to show a lot of this yesterday. The loss of Yeo and Arana leaves only Cholo as the fearless slasher in your lineup. If the new guards of UE perform well as they have shown they can do, then they can defend well against the fastbreak and help Marcy and James in their own fastbreak as well. Both JV/Tyrone and Marcy/James may cancel each other out. This brings us to the small forward/shooting guard/power forward comparison. Here UE I think has the height and experience and a little edge in shooting. Malabes, Barua and OJ shouldn't have an off-day for you to keep in step with UE. Your smaller small forwards have to hustle and make some steals off the taller UE guys.


when you put it that way, then i agree.....i just hope that ty gets his breakout game in this match.

chinky_06
11-27-2006, 03:17 PM
Yup, they have a lot of 2-3 guys who can definitely play, excluding Marcy. Saw a brief of their performance last night but didn't finish the game, so I don't know who won... But then, among all the teams in the Homegrown, UE is the team to beat. They have been doing very well since the UAAp and the CCL. And those are the leagues DLSu wasn't able to perform...

flsfnoeraekadad
11-27-2006, 11:19 PM
^^ I said earlier that you are not that quick anymore without Yeo and Arana. So no more a lot of fastbreak points. Would you believe that UE scored several fastbreak points vs. the already fast FEU team? Those guys - Gregorio, Canizares and Borboran can really dribble and run. Yes it's going to be a good game. I understand that you will meet UE on Dec. 13 which is the semis. The top 2 teams in the same bracket will fight for the semis. No crossovers.

If La Salle can't run, what do you call the destruction that the Archers did to FEU? Will FEU be given another chance to slip another excuse because of your argument? :D

brian
11-28-2006, 01:09 AM
Yup, they have a lot of 2-3 guys who can definitely play, excluding Marcy. Saw a brief of their performance last night but didn't finish the game, so I don't know who won... But then, among all the teams in the Homegrown, UE is the team to beat. They have been doing very well since the UAAp and the CCL. And those are the leagues DLSu wasn't able to perform...


sayang, if only we had been given an assurance that no year of eligibility would be taken away from our players if we did join the champions league, then nagkaalaman na sana....aysus ang uaap talaga

brian
11-28-2006, 01:10 AM
^^ I said earlier that you are not that quick anymore without Yeo and Arana. So no more a lot of fastbreak points. Would you believe that UE scored several fastbreak points vs. the already fast FEU team? Those guys - Gregorio, Canizares and Borboran can really dribble and run. Yes it's going to be a good game. I understand that you will meet UE on Dec. 13 which is the semis. The top 2 teams in the same bracket will fight for the semis. No crossovers.

If La Salle can't run, what do you call the destruction that the Archers did to FEU? Will FEU be given another chance to slip another excuse because of your argument? :D


a walk in the park ? ;D he he!

Kid Cubao
11-28-2006, 05:07 AM
it only goes to show that speed and aggressiveness are embedded in the pumaren system. it doesn't matter if you're not that quick and athletically gifted to begin with--you will eventually become quick and athletic because you are trained to be like that by the coaching staff. case in point: the 2003 green archers. those who say that la salle doesn't have the greyhounds that they had in years past and hence doesn't have what it takes to get to contention next season are deluding themselves ;D

gfy
11-28-2006, 07:25 AM
Your massacre of FEU I'd compare to our massacre of UST in the first round. FEU will improve. They did better in bringing the ball to their front court in the UE game. Turnovers. It wasn't because you ran faster than FEU.

I don't see Casio and T@ng getting any faster like Yeo or Macky. Atkins maybe. After them you have Malabes, Barua, OJ and Villanueva. Maybe Barua. As for their big men, only Maierhofer can run. Last year, Yeo and Arana scored a lot of points on fastbreak because they were outsprinting everybody else. Same with Macky. Even Cabatu could run. It's either you're a natural sprinter or not. You can only do so much.

bigfreeze_bibby
11-28-2006, 11:16 AM
JV a bit slower? I have to think before I'll agree with that statement. I don't see him as one of our slow pokes. Let's just see on December 13.

gfy
11-28-2006, 12:14 PM
^^ I am not saying he's slow (didn't his bulking up slow him down a bit?). But as compared to Yeo, Macky or Marvin Cruz? Fortunately for you UE's guards aren't that quick either. Maybe just Marcy. But Gregorio, Borboran, Canizares, Espiritu and a few others run like giraffes even on the dribble.

All teams are going to improve. Jervy Cruz has now a consistent medium-range jumper (or were Taganas and the other guards assigned to Jervy just slow to defend?). The Archers will improve. I hope the Eagles as well.

bigfreeze_bibby
11-28-2006, 01:29 PM
^^ I am not saying he's slow (didn't his bulking up slow him down a bit?). But as compared to Yeo, Macky or Marvin Cruz?


For me, his bulking up didn't slow his game. He's more active now slashing the basket as compared to previous years. Yeo's faster but I think he can match up with Macky and Marvin. JV's one of our underrated defenders.

nel
11-28-2006, 01:39 PM
In the Homegrown Cup, JV's been showing a new facet of his game - the ability to score on the drive. Whereas he used to content himself with jumpers from the outside, he is now a threat as a slasher.

Let's not confuse quickness with speed. JV is quick, and he has to be to score inside against the tall defenders of the opponents. He won't win any sprint races, which is where you measure speed, but in terms of quickness of his reflexes and moves, the ability to spot and take advantage of any situation, JV has improved considerably.

The rest of the Archers are trained to be quick as well. They have to be if they want to make the pressure defense and trap work. During the press trap of an inbound play after they score, note that they can spot the slightest hesitation of an opponent and take advantage of it. Speed isn't as important as quickness in this respect.

shyboy
11-28-2006, 02:13 PM
I agree that our players are trained to be quick. But they look quicker because of how they position themselves when they do the trap. They force the opponent to move to a designated area and the passing lanes are thus anticipated when they double the ballhandler. They seem quicker than the opponent but it's merely getting ahead of the offense by knowing where the ball would be before reaching the recipient of the pass.

The Green Archers play team ball and this is why they've been very successfull in recent years. Note that not all our players excel individually when they reach the PBA. On paper, we're always not the strongest man for man. But when its game time, each one knows his role in the team and, thus, we play cohesively as a unit.

gfy
11-28-2006, 02:26 PM
It is then the speed to the basket which Yeo and Arana provided last year that you will have to make up for. And that's a lot of points. Quickness by your definition can be taught. Reflexes can be improved by conditioning and training and practice.

brian
11-28-2006, 02:55 PM
gfy,

so what's your point really? matatalo kami because we don't have yeo and arana anymore?......my point is, we'll just have to see, won't we?

nel
11-28-2006, 05:04 PM
Speed is important only on the break when you want to get to the basket unopposed, or if you're running back to defend a fastbreak by the opponents. In an open court game featuring run and gun oriented teams, speed will give a team an advantage. However, most games end up being a mix of half court sets interspersed with fastbreaks whenever the opportunity presents itself. Archers ball requires that the team be adept at both.

Speed doesn't necessarily translate into quickness, and vice versa. A fast player may not have quick reaction times, and players who can't sprint can be quick. Look at Jerwin Gaco, who despite being undersized at PF, gets his share of rebounds because he's quick to box out and get into the right position.

Basketball isn't a game of sprints. Half court sets negate any speed advantage a team may have, and give a quick team the edge (quick to the ball, quickness in getting into position, rebounding, etc). A perceived lack of speed will not be a cause of worry for the Archers. It's their lack of competition and general rustiness that must be addressed if they will be competitive in Season 70. As Franz has often said, the Archers are still a long way from being ready for next year's UAAP wars.

jembengzon
11-28-2006, 06:03 PM
Speed is important only on the break when you want to get to the basket unopposed, or if you're running back to defend a fastbreak by the opponents. In an open court game featuring run and gun oriented teams, speed will give a team an advantage. However, most games end up being a mix of half court sets interspersed with fastbreaks whenever the opportunity presents itself. Archers ball requires that the team be adept at both.

Speed doesn't necessarily translate into quickness, and vice versa. A fast player may not have quick reaction times, and players who can't sprint can be quick. Look at Jerwin Gaco, who despite being undersized at PF, gets his share of rebounds because he's quick to box out and get into the right position.

Basketball isn't a game of sprints. Half court sets negate any speed advantage a team may have, and give a quick team the edge (quick to the ball, quickness in getting into position, rebounding, etc). A perceived lack of speed will not be a cause of worry for the Archers. It's their lack of competition and general rustiness that must be addressed if they will be competitive in Season 70. As Franz has often said, the Archers are still a long way from being ready for next year's UAAP wars.


speed is an innate, God given talent, but what makes dlsu's press work is its individual and team quickness.

dlsu plays with a great understanding of strength and positioning, bursts of speed, spacing, good reads, tons of aggressiveness, and high team intelligence. this is accomplished because everyone knows what his role is on the team, and how to contribute effectively. thus, they are able to gamble effectively, and surprise opponents, because each one knows where the other is supposed to be, and that kind of aggressiveness results in great gambles and a high success rate. that in turn leads to a high confidence level in their system, and in each other.

a classic example of this is a player like mon jose. he will never be confused with a world class sprinter, but he made their press work with great positioning and great reads, plus strong finishes. it's the secondary like jose that made ritualo and company much more effective.

while ue has had the benefit of playing competitvely the whole year, and dlsu is still shaking off the rust, i think the team overall team intelligence factor favors dlsu. they have consistently shown a very high team IQ, while ue has made some questionable decisions during crunch time.

gfy
11-28-2006, 08:21 PM
Brian - Of course we'll just have to wait and see. All I'm saying is that the fastbreak points scored by Yeo and Arana were a big factor in your wins last year. Although I agree that teamwork and high IQ are important, I don't see you in many fastbreak situations next year with your current personnel in the 1-2-3 positions. Of course that's my own opinion. Since I believe you will have little success in pressing UE and forcing turnovers, you might consider slashing to score points just like FEU. Unfortunately, Malabes, Barua and OJ still have to learn a lot re slashing. They can't just depend on their outside shots to fall in all the time. Besides UE has tall defenders to challenge those shots. Without Custodio, UE has improved on teamwork. And like UST players in the PBL, their PBL experience will be very valuable next year.

Re JRU, their pgs and sgs (2 of them discards from FEU) can easily be pressed. But their forwards and centers play very physical and are quite good.

bigfreeze_bibby
11-29-2006, 07:06 AM
I have to agree on jembengzon's perfect example of Mon Jose's role in the team especially in the defensive end during his stint with the Archers. He's not that speedy but he was one of the Archers' best defenders during that time.

As regards UE, I'll think about the JRU game first. After that, let's focus on UE. Yes, JRU's guards can be pressed and that is already a plus factor for us. Their forwards may be physical but I know we can stay toe-to-toe with their physicality, just don't lose control (paging Brian Ilad here hehe) and focus in the game and it will be alright.

Fried Green Tomato
11-29-2006, 11:19 AM
To equate La Salle's nightmare press or even the system itself to just sheer speed or quickness is belittling the philosophy behind the system.

Speed is a factor to its success but what makes our press very effective is in the implementation. There are many speedier players or even quicker teams but they don't have the system to maximize the effectiveness of such gift.

The big difference --- the system equips the players with good basketball sense (intelligence) thus it looks good whenever we implement it.

And that's the bottomline.

gfy
11-29-2006, 01:32 PM
I think I got us all mixed-up ( I am not a technical expert). I was referring to simple fastbreaks, i.e. after DLSU gets the ball from either rebounding or turnovers, you saw last year Yeo or Arana (who are relatively tall and who's good at stealing the ball in the case of Arana) streaking down the court either to catch a pass or dribbling the ball themselves for unmolested lay-ups. In the case of the press, the objective is to force a turnover or to use up much time off the shot clock of the opponent. And as everybody has explained this requires high IQ, anticipation and so forth.

Wingman
12-02-2006, 06:54 PM
Well we don't need to streak downcourt coz we steal the ball right from the inbound. So speed isn't neccessary anymore. Just make the opposing team look like an inter-baranggay team who doesn't know how to inbound the ball.

Ranger
12-03-2006, 10:32 AM
I think I got us all mixed-up ( I am not a technical expert). I was referring to simple fastbreaks, i.e. after DLSU gets the ball from either rebounding or turnovers, you saw last year Yeo or Arana (who are relatively tall and who's good at stealing the ball in the case of Arana) streaking down the court either to catch a pass or dribbling the ball themselves for unmolested lay-ups. In the case of the press, the objective is to force a turnover or to use up much time off the shot clock of the opponent. And as everybody has explained this requires high IQ, anticipation and so forth.


Cge mag bulagbulagan ka pa!!!!

bigfreeze_bibby
12-03-2006, 09:06 PM
I think I got us all mixed-up ( I am not a technical expert). I was referring to simple fastbreaks, i.e. after DLSU gets the ball from either rebounding or turnovers, you saw last year Yeo or Arana (who are relatively tall and who's good at stealing the ball in the case of Arana) streaking down the court either to catch a pass or dribbling the ball themselves for unmolested lay-ups. In the case of the press, the objective is to force a turnover or to use up much time off the shot clock of the opponent. And as everybody has explained this requires high IQ, anticipation and so forth.


Cge mag bulagbulagan ka pa!!!!


Easy ka lang pre puso mo hehehe. Ganyan lang yan talaga si gfy, at least he's making us laugh with his analysis hehehe. Matutupad na ang inaabangang laban ni gfy sa tin against UE. Now, we can all set our focus on the Red Warriors. For me, they have good match ups on us and I certainly feel that UE has some advantages but then let's see in terms of execution. Dun magkakatalo ang DLSU and UE. Ang unang kumurap ika nga nila, talo.

It was a good test game for us earlier. Napaka-physical ng game kanina. JRU's players were all scrappy and we were clearly outhustled in some rebound plays giving JRU instant put backs especially Dedicatoria until coach Franz put Rico to guard Dedicatoria, medyo na-neutralize si Dedicatoria since Rico is more athletic than him and match sila sa reach. We can't lose our focus just like what happened to us in our game earlier when we face UE in the semis game. Sa kangkungan tayo pupulutin nito pag nawala focus natin against UE.

gfy
12-03-2006, 09:37 PM
Looked like you were the ones pressed today :D. I credit Vanguardia for at least having an answer to your press. If not for the successive dribbling errors by rookie Tumulak and the other pg in the last minutes, the outcome might have been different. And if only JRU had 20% of UE's firepower from the outside... Rebounding? Your big men need to be quicker and hustle not just a bit. This game also showed your vulnerability vs. slashers. Fouls aplenty as well. Fastbreaks? Forget it.

UE showed a somewhat new play today in their game against UST. Some quick passing among their big men (forwards and center - they are all like centers to me) near and under the basket resulting in easy baskets for one of them.

brian
12-03-2006, 09:43 PM
gfy,

we were off today, 20 % lang ng potential namin ang lumitaw kanina haha ;D

oh well, a win is still a win!!!!ahe he!

gfy
12-03-2006, 10:17 PM
^^ Naisip ko na yan. I was going to say you're back to 55% of your potential yan lang baka magalit na sa akin si GA na kababayan ko hehe. I am not against your team. I am just saying that UE is the team to beat next year more than even UST. They will continue to improve especially their PBL players.

LION
12-04-2006, 07:59 AM
Easy ka lang pre puso mo hehehe. Ganyan lang yan talaga si gfy, at least he's making us laugh with his analysis hehehe. Matutupad na ang inaabangang laban ni gfy sa tin against UE. Now, we can all set our focus on the Red Warriors. For me, they have good match ups on us and I certainly feel that UE has some advantages but then let's see in terms of execution. Dun magkakatalo ang DLSU and UE. Ang unang kumurap ika nga nila, talo.

It was a good test game for us earlier. Napaka-physical ng game kanina. JRU's players were all scrappy and we were clearly outhustled in some rebound plays giving JRU instant put backs especially Dedicatoria until coach Franz put Rico to guard Dedicatoria, medyo na-neutralize si Dedicatoria since Rico is more athletic than him and match sila sa reach. We can't lose our focus just like what happened to us in our game earlier when we face UE in the semis game. Sa kangkungan tayo pupulutin nito pag nawala focus natin against UE.


bigfreeze,

Congrats to La Salle for winning the game against JRU.* Ganun talaga ang laro ng mga teams sa NCAA.* Tame pa nga yung laro ng JRU kahapon.* It was a "physical game" but not rough and dirty.* JRU is a scrappy team and their players will fight for every rebound and loose ball.* They know that they are not that tall and not that talented so they compensate by working real hard.* You have to admire JRU for that.*

This early, Brian Ilad should realize that basketball is a physical game.* Huwag masyado dapat mainit ang ulo.* Kaya nawawala ang focus niya sa game dahil sa init ng ulo.* He could really be good if he stays focused and accepts the fact this game involves a lot of shoving and holding.* Sayang yung potential niya kung hindi niya matatanggap yan.

Btw, I am impressed with Cholo Villanueva's playing style. Simpleng simple ang laro niya. No fancy moves. His medium range jumper is very accurate. Siguradong pasok sa ring. Silent but deadly.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-04-2006, 09:08 AM
bigfreeze,

Congrats to La Salle for winning the game against JRU.* Ganun talaga ang laro ng mga teams sa NCAA.* Tame pa nga yung laro ng JRU kahapon.* It was a "physical game" but not rough and dirty.* JRU is a scrappy team and their players will fight for every rebound and loose ball.* They know that they are not that tall and not that talented so they compensate by working real hard.* You have to admire JRU for that.*

This early, Brian Ilad should realize that basketball is a physical game.* Huwag masyado dapat mainit ang ulo.* Kaya nawawala ang focus niya sa game dahil sa init ng ulo.* He could really be good if he stays focused and accepts the fact this game involves a lot of shoving and holding.* Sayang yung potential niya kung hindi niya matatanggap yan.

Btw, I am impressed with Cholo Villanueva's playing style. Simpleng simple ang laro niya. No fancy moves. His medium range jumper is very accurate.* Siguradong pasok sa ring.* Silent but deadly.


Kung mapapansin ninyo hirap kami pag NCAA teams ang kalaban because of the physical nature ng laro. It was pretty obvious that the boys lost their focus nung umulan ng fouls for us in the 2nd quarter and madaming na-foul trouble. Di na naging agressive ang mga bata sa paglalaro, lahat naging "off" ang laro until the 2nd half na buti na lang nakalaban kami ng dikitan with the Bombers.

Medyo tame pa kahapon si Brian, mabuti na lang kasi malamang with the fouls that was given to him, di malayong nagkaroon ng rumble hehehe. I think JRU has the height maybe I am wrong pero tingin ko may height and ceiling din sila, that's one factor that I see kaya kami nahirapan sa rebounding. Aside from JRU's hustle and athleticism, may katangkaran din sila kaya medyo kailangan talaga ng adjustment sa frontline na kailangan ipasok sa laro si Brian and Rico instead of PJ (Walsham) and Kish and even Marko.

Off Topic: Galing ng panalo niyo sa Letran kahapon. Tirona played well. Si Camus konting hasa pa okay na wingman yan. Matangkad and tumatakbo. I was happy to see "Papi" Galinato stepping up nung crunch time when he hit the game leading turn around jumpshot hehe.

nel
12-04-2006, 09:30 AM
The game-time decision making of the Archers is still off, probably because of their long layoff from active competition. There were several errant passes, bad shots taken with lots of time remaining on the shot clock, and slow response to loose ball situations (lack of hustle plays). JRU was quicker to the ball, both off the boards and chasing down loose balls. Perhaps if JRU had more confidence in their outside shots in the 4th quarter, the game could have ended differently.

LION
12-04-2006, 09:57 AM
[
Medyo tame pa kahapon si Brian, mabuti na lang kasi malamang with the fouls that was given to him, di malayong nagkaroon ng rumble hehehe.

I know hehehe. At saka medyo napigilan kaagad ng mga kasama niya sa loob hehehe.


Off Topic: Galing ng panalo niyo sa Letran kahapon. I was happy to see "Papi" Galinato stepping up nung crunch time when he hit the game leading turn around jumpshot hehe.


Salamat. The problem with Galinato is that he seems to have lost his confidence. Mukhang resigned na yung bata na hindi makapaglaro sa Team A due to his academics. I just don't know how he is doing now.

Inaantay ko na ang DLSU vs. UE game.

Press vs. press. Dapat bakbakan yan ng husto. Wala ng experiment expreriment pa.

oca
12-04-2006, 10:17 AM
Game down to less than 6 minutes, score tied at 56-all. By the time the shot clock read 44 seconds, the score was 68-58.

One can point out the crucial rebounds, blocks, errors. The bigger picture is - pag dikitan ang laro - DLSU always play steadier at end game.

That's what make the Archers very difficult to beat.

Pero yung si Ilad, I hate to say this, pero sa susunod na UAAP season, he can cost you some games. There was no need for his antics yesterday. Panalo na yun, pare que... The worst part was, at the final buzzer he didn't even cross the midcourt para makipag-kamay sa mga JRU players.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-04-2006, 11:20 AM
I know hehehe.* At saka medyo napigilan kaagad ng mga kasama niya sa loob hehehe.

Salamat.* The problem with Galinato is that he seems to have lost his confidence. Mukhang resigned na yung bata na hindi makapaglaro sa Team A due to his academics. I just don't know how he is doing now.

Inaantay ko na ang DLSU vs. UE game.

Press vs. press.* Dapat bakbakan yan ng husto. Wala ng experiment expreriment pa.


Naawat si Brian ni Walsham, which resulted to Walsham's technical foul because biglaan siyang pumasok sa court.

Ser oca, yes, Brian's hot headedness will definitely cost us some games next season kung di lumamig ulo niya and tingin ko ginagawan na naman ng paraan yan. Sana magbago for next season hehehe.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-04-2006, 11:26 AM
The game-time decision making of the Archers is still off, probably because of their long layoff from active competition. There were several errant passes, bad shots taken with lots of time remaining on the shot clock, and slow response to loose ball situations (lack of hustle plays). JRU was quicker to the ball, both off the boards and chasing down loose balls. Perhaps if JRU had more confidence in their outside shots in the 4th quarter, the game could have ended differently.


Eto yung resulta nung pagkawala ng focus ng Archers due to foul trouble and the physicality ng JRU during the 2nd and 3rd quarters. Buti na lang talaga naka-recover tayo in due time nung 4th quarter.

Kid Cubao
12-04-2006, 11:41 AM
if bryan still hasn't learned his painful lesson from jervy cruz, he will be a marked man not only from opposing teams but also from opposing fans. he has to play under control or else he'll be as useful to la salle as a freezer in siberia.

nel
12-04-2006, 11:48 AM
Buti na lang na hindi na-rattle ang mga players. They weren't able to generate that explosive stretch which gives the easy burst of points that usually is punctuated by a full-court press and trap on the inbound play, kaya medyo dikit ang laban once JRU caught up. They methodically built up that 68-58 lead by going back to their basic strengths.

Kaya lang, it seemed that their reflexes were a tad slow yesterday. Wala yung usually quickness kaya nauunahan sa loose ball. Kung baga, hindi razor sharp. And JRU may have used up a lot of energy trying to catch up.

==================

Off topic: Is Camus related to the former PBA player (I think he played center for Toyota)? Galinato seems to have slimmed down a lot since his stint with the Archers. He's always had the moves, but doesn't seem to have the confidence to make an impact yet.

brian
12-04-2006, 11:59 AM
i actually am a little glad that we were put in that kind of situation in our game yesterday. honestly, i wouldn't even mind losing against the bombers if only for the reasoin that we could address the issues in regards to the loss immediately....any winning streak is bound to be snapped sooner or later, and what better time but against the scrappy and hardworking jru bombers..

now we look forward to the warriors with lessons learned and more resolve all thanks to the game yesterday..

animo la salle!!!

LION
12-04-2006, 01:11 PM
Off topic: Is Camus related to the former PBA player (I think he played center for Toyota)? Galinato seems to have slimmed down a lot since his stint with the Archers. He's always had the moves, but doesn't seem to have the confidence to make an impact yet.


Chris Camus is the son of Ed Camus, the former PBA player.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-04-2006, 02:09 PM
if bryan still hasn't learned his painful lesson from jervy cruz, he will be a marked man not only from opposing teams but also from opposing fans. he has to play under control or else he'll be as useful to la salle as a freezer in siberia.


Not only that, pati sa mga refs iinit ang tingin sa kanya dun and it will take away his aggressiveness and yung diskarte sa game niya. Tingin ko maayos din yan. To be honest we need a player na ala-Jerwin Gaco ang dating na mala-enforcer sa loob.

gfy
12-04-2006, 03:09 PM
I told you about Ilad last year. He will not only cost you some games but will continue to give you a "palaaway" reputation just like that guy who went over to the JRU side yesterday. I suggested that with Fampulme in the UE lineup (a recipe for disaster) the organizers reinforce the police contingent assigned to ULTRA* ::).

FEU was not the same this year with the departure of Arwind, Isip and Rizada. Ateneo will be hard-pressed (pun not intended) next year without Macky, JC and Kramer. So what makes DLSU the exception without Yeo, Arana and Cabatu? UE will also lose key players after next season.

Those guys at APcom are taking my 30% potential seriously* :D. I just wanted to say that ALL teams will improve next year. Even UE and UST.

mighty_lion
12-04-2006, 03:16 PM
Medyo tame pa kahapon si Brian, mabuti na lang kasi malamang with the fouls that was given to him, di malayong nagkaroon ng rumble hehehe.
I know hehehe.* At saka medyo napigilan kaagad ng mga kasama niya sa loob hehehe.
Off Topic: Galing ng panalo niyo sa Letran kahapon.* I was happy to see "Papi" Galinato stepping up nung crunch time when he hit the game leading turn around jumpshot hehe.

Salamat.* The problem with Galinato is that he seems to have lost his confidence. Mukhang resigned na yung bata na hindi makapaglaro sa Team A due to his academics. I just don't know how he is doing now.
Inaantay ko na ang DLSU vs. UE game.
Press vs. press.* Dapat bakbakan yan ng husto. Wala ng experiment expreriment pa.

The game versus Letran should have given DLSU an experience for a press. Though I would say, UE's defense is far better press team than that of Letran. But Letran press is a signature one, its a combination of press defense with physical game.

glock23
12-04-2006, 10:38 PM
if bryan still hasn't learned his painful lesson from jervy cruz, he will be a marked man not only from opposing teams but also from opposing fans. he has to play under control or else he'll be as useful to la salle as a freezer in siberia.


Not only that, pati sa mga refs iinit ang tingin sa kanya dun and it will take away his aggressiveness and yung diskarte sa game niya. Tingin ko maayos din yan. To be honest we need a player na ala-Jerwin Gaco ang dating na mala-enforcer sa loob.



Maaayos talaga yan! if you look at the hits brian has been getting all game long, i would have reacted the same way too. Brian ilad caught the eyes of all teams in this tournament as a very strong player, much like jervy cruz in the recent uaap wars, and they know they have to be hard on him or else he will score at will near the basket. I have faith in our coaching staff that they'll know what to do.

MonL
12-05-2006, 08:21 AM
if bryan still hasn't learned his painful lesson from jervy cruz, he will be a marked man not only from opposing teams but also from opposing fans. he has to play under control or else he'll be as useful to la salle as a freezer in siberia.


Not only that, pati sa mga refs iinit ang tingin sa kanya dun and it will take away his aggressiveness and yung diskarte sa game niya. Tingin ko maayos din yan. To be honest we need a player na ala-Jerwin Gaco ang dating na mala-enforcer sa loob.



Maaayos talaga yan! if you look at the hits brian has been getting all game long, i would have reacted the same way too. Brian ilad caught the eyes of all teams in this tournament as a very strong player, much like jervy cruz in the recent uaap wars, and they know they have to be hard on him or else he will score at will near the basket. I have faith in our coaching staff that they'll know what to do.


He caught the public eye with his FMC scuffle with Jervy Cruz. Needlessly. That perception as a hothead lingers on. And with that perception comes needless heightened vigilance (and provocation) on him. Instead of him laying down the law, the law will be laid down on him. Will we really see a breakout game from him? I'd like to think we can. But it depends on him now.

chinky_06
12-05-2006, 12:15 PM
I told you about Ilad last year. He will not only cost you some games but will continue to give you a "palaaway" reputation just like that guy who went over to the JRU side yesterday. I suggested that with Fampulme in the UE lineup (a recipe for disaster) the organizers reinforce the police contingent assigned to ULTRA .

FEU was not the same this year with the departure of Arwind, Isip and Rizada. Ateneo will be hard-pressed (pun not intended) next year without Macky, JC and Kramer. So what makes DLSU the exception without Yeo, Arana and Cabatu? UE will also lose key players after next season.

Those guys at APcom are taking my 30% potential seriously . I just wanted to say that ALL teams will improve next year. Even UE and UST.

Ask ko lang po, what happened ba between UE and UST? What did Fampulme do? I don't think police reinforcement is necessary, with basketball players, they're all bark and show, especially the big guys, hahaha! But once they know you mean business, they shrink back with their tails between their legs. I understand Fampulme is a big guy, but he can't be that violent, well, if you will add all the giants in the UE team (they're one of the tallest teams in Homegrown, right?) and there were some scrupples that also happened between DLSU and JRU crowd?

Can't wait for the DLSU-UE match...

Kid Cubao
12-05-2006, 12:55 PM
hindi pala-away si mark fampulme. matagal na naming napapanood ang laro nyan mula pa nung nasa lyceum pa sya. laro lang ang batang yan. he's a banger, yes, but not a war freak.

gfy
12-05-2006, 01:01 PM
Mighty_Lion is correct. JRU and Letran (which almost beat DLSU) have shown that, when pressed, *DLSU's shooters/scorers like Tang, Casio, Malabes and Barua couldn't take decent shots and they had to depend on slashers like Villanueva and their big men to score.

Fampulme is breaking records in getting unsportsmanlike/technical fouls in the tournament.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-05-2006, 03:57 PM
Fampulme is breaking records in getting unsportsmanlike/technical fouls in the tournament.


I've seen one as well in the FMC2 hehehe. Malakas mangalabaw sa ilalim pero kulang pa sa control ng laro. Once he mixes up properly that kalabaw power and control inside okay na si Fampulme.

glock23
12-06-2006, 02:24 PM
if bryan still hasn't learned his painful lesson from jervy cruz, he will be a marked man not only from opposing teams but also from opposing fans. he has to play under control or else he'll be as useful to la salle as a freezer in siberia.


Not only that, pati sa mga refs iinit ang tingin sa kanya dun and it will take away his aggressiveness and yung diskarte sa game niya. Tingin ko maayos din yan. To be honest we need a player na ala-Jerwin Gaco ang dating na mala-enforcer sa loob.



Maaayos talaga yan! if you look at the hits brian has been getting all game long, i would have reacted the same way too. Brian ilad caught the eyes of all teams in this tournament as a very strong player, much like jervy cruz in the recent uaap wars, and they know they have to be hard on him or else he will score at will near the basket. I have faith in our coaching staff that they'll know what to do.


He caught the public eye with his FMC scuffle with Jervy Cruz. Needlessly. That perception as a hothead lingers on. And with that perception comes needless heightened vigilance (and provocation) on him. Instead of him laying down the law, the law will be laid down on him. Will we really see a breakout game from him? I'd like to think we can. But it depends on him now.



give him time man. i think he did well against ateneo, cause they noticed his strength under the basket, and thats coming from my atenean friends. but of course their standards may not be as high as yours. and of course he will not be as great as THE sam ekwe

MonL
12-06-2006, 03:45 PM
if bryan still hasn't learned his painful lesson from jervy cruz, he will be a marked man not only from opposing teams but also from opposing fans. he has to play under control or else he'll be as useful to la salle as a freezer in siberia.


Not only that, pati sa mga refs iinit ang tingin sa kanya dun and it will take away his aggressiveness and yung diskarte sa game niya. Tingin ko maayos din yan. To be honest we need a player na ala-Jerwin Gaco ang dating na mala-enforcer sa loob.



Maaayos talaga yan! if you look at the hits brian has been getting all game long, i would have reacted the same way too. Brian ilad caught the eyes of all teams in this tournament as a very strong player, much like jervy cruz in the recent uaap wars, and they know they have to be hard on him or else he will score at will near the basket. I have faith in our coaching staff that they'll know what to do.


He caught the public eye with his FMC scuffle with Jervy Cruz. Needlessly. That perception as a hothead lingers on. And with that perception comes needless heightened vigilance (and provocation) on him. Instead of him laying down the law, the law will be laid down on him. Will we really see a breakout game from him? I'd like to think we can. But it depends on him now.



give him time man. i think he did well against ateneo, cause they noticed his strength under the basket, and thats coming from my atenean friends. but of course their standards may not be as high as yours. and of course he will not be as great as THE sam ekwe


Major minutes, impact plays, significant game contributions. Even intangibles, like toughness. That's what's asked of him. In a way, just like we asked from Sam. That's all. And Ilad gave a glimpse of what he could do. And that means for him to stay focused and stay IN the game.

Peace out.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-06-2006, 06:28 PM
Bri maybe needs some Anger Management 101 classes just to "control" the burning passion inside him. He's a strong player but his sometimes uncontrollable passion may cause for our momentum to stop and to switch to the opposition.

And gfy needs to really stop interfering and picking with our lineup. Someone please do, please?

Sidenotes: We have our third semifinalist in the HGC - in the form of JRU. I think Ateneo and UST still has a chance to crack the semis. Ateneo can do it by beating UP badly with a large margin and UST through prayers and lucky breaks cause the Tigers are not playing anymore.

gfy
12-06-2006, 09:07 PM
^^ Some people were saying that DLSU's team is strong and will be hard to beat. And it will be stronger by next year. I just wanted to show the other side of the coin. The same way I and other Ateneans gave our honest opinion of our own team.

Well here's the final rub. I asked Mr. Pumaren (the father) today who he thinks will win the DLSU-UE semis. He told me and by how many points. Hint: He said that Yeo is a great loss to La Salle.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-06-2006, 09:56 PM
A win is a win and a loss is a loss but in between that the Archers will give their 100 percent against UE and I don't think the Archers will take Yeo's absence as an impediment to giving out a strong performance against UE next week.

nel
12-07-2006, 07:34 AM
gfy,

Yeo was a big loss to the Archers, but no more than the loss of our other key players in years past, like Renren, Don Allado, Mon Jose, Mike Cortez, Calijohn Orfrecio, Junjun Cabatu, Ryan Arana, and other good players who helped the Archers attain that enviable track record. Our teams were never built around any player; it was the players who had to fit into the system. Yeo brought a lot to the table with his strong individual skills, but it was his contribution to team play that allowed the team to succeed.

Any player who leaves the Archers for any reason leaves a void, but that void is filled by others who wait in line for their opportunity to crack the lineup, as well as his teammates who step up their games. Every year, we lose players to graduation or for other reasons. The system caters for that turnstile reality, because it's a fact of life. Any team that can sustain its competitiveness owes its success to the coach and the philosophy that he follows (Aric del Rosario masterfully steered UST to consecutive championships in the 90s) that takes into consideration the coming and going of key players. On his teams, nobody was indispensable, yet his Tigers dominated the UAAP for a time.

We thank you for appreciating the abilities of our players, in much the same way as we like the way some of your players like Macky Escalona and Doug Kramer have performed beyond expectations this year. Just as Ateneo will have to adjust because of the departure of your 3 Kings, so will La Salle. And I daresay that the team may end up being stronger for it.

gfy
12-07-2006, 08:59 PM
^^ I agree with you about the system. But you also have to look at your current personnel. Casio and Tang, just like our guards, can easily be pressed by taller defenders from other schools. Malabes, Barua and Cua should learn how to be effective slashers just like Villanueva and not just depend on their outside shots. Besides, they aren't yet consistent and reliable shooters like Casio and Tang. Your advantage are your big men. Just imagine if Co, Walsham and Batrievic could develop into a Jervy Cruz or a Bono by next year.

Fried Green Tomato
12-08-2006, 07:23 AM
Players come & go and that's the reality of amateur basketball. Yeo and arana were great losses but so with cardona, ritualo, cortez, allado and other great green archers of the past. The departure is an inevitable fact... we just have to accept it and move on. And with the departure, an opportunity arises for the remaining green archers to carry on the fight and fill in the vacancy in the team.

When you have a good system, then your worry lessens. Other teams with no define system would definitely feel the vacuum left by their prominent players... but not La Salle. Season after season, green archers come & go but so with the smooth transition from one la salle team to another. If you plan well ahead of time then the eventual departure becomes a routine.

Kid Cubao
12-08-2006, 07:42 AM
i think the current crop of la salle players are fine as they are, gfy. you don't need to be a slasher to get inside. even a lard-butt like marko batritevic will find himself free inside if he is set up properly by his teammates ;D

you've got some ways to go before you appreciate the nuances of the game hehehe!

gfy
12-08-2006, 11:46 AM
Kid - I know that. All I am saying is that it is always a plus if their guys can outsprint their defenders (have you seen Macky's fastbreaks in the PBL?) and have superior dribbling and slashing skills (particularly in press situations) which Yeo and Arana were very good at. This is what DLSU is missing now and which I don't see in their current lineup. This was very evident in their JRU and Letran games where they were pressed almost during the entire game. They will win games with their "system" of course but will not be dominant like in the past.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-08-2006, 01:31 PM
It's okay to be not that dominant (maybe gfy's measure for dominance is winning in big margins every single game) for as long as we get the "W" every single game (how close it may be) and win championships, I can still call that as dominance. All teams have their own weaknesses and apparently, gfy has pointed out weaknesses that we have in our current lineup which can be the cause should we lose to UE, or other teams in the future.

All I can say is that all teams may see our weaknesses, put the strategies in place and execute them come gametime but we are not that stupid not to adjust on what the other team is giving us. It all boils down to which team has put the better adjustment. We will adjust accordingly and will try our very best to win every single game.

nel
12-08-2006, 02:50 PM
I think that success is still a better measure than dominance. A successful team will have enough weapons to pull out that very important "W", even if it's not firing on all cylinders.

For example, the Archers of years past would always fall back on their defense to win games. Very rarely would the Archers win by a blow out, the key was to hold the score of the opponents below theirs. If you'll look at the scores of the Archers' opponents last year, very rarely would they breach the 90's. There was no need for an explosive scorer from La Salle to dominate the points tally, and the Archers would not pile on the points as long as the win was secured. Look at the FEU game, where they could easily have tallied over 100 points, but didn't.

Part of the edge comes from the combined mental and physical aspect. Teams don't know if and when the Archers will spring the press and trap, which usually results in consecutive baskets by the Archers within the span of a minute. Sometimes, that's all it takes to break away in a close game. The whole-game full court press also tends to wear down the less conditioned teams, and there's no respite from the press. Everyone on the DLSU is prepared to press whenever he's on the floor.

As bigfreeze_bibby said, the final margin is not as important as getting the win. Good teams wil find a way to win. I'd like to think that against JRU, the Archers showed their true mettle when they pulled away in the last 4 minutes. It may not have been pretty, but a win is a win.

pio_valenz
12-08-2006, 04:19 PM
Too early to make an accurate assessment on what's "missing" or what the Archers (or any other team for that matter) don't have yet in their line-up. We're only in December, and the high school recruits haven't entered the equation yet. Who knows, maybe that slasher that you're looking for, gfy, will come in the form of a new recruit no one knows anything about as of now.

In any case, I say any coach worth his salt will always be able to adjust properly with the material he has. I don't think Pumaren will approach recruitment and training with the mindset, "Oh, Yeo and Arana are no longer with us. Let's go out and get ourselves a slasher." Unless the lost personnel are several big men or point guards (the two hardest positions to replace, IMHO), the coach won't just blindly try and find clones to the players he's lost.

Yeo is a big loss, no doubt. But he's a big loss not because of his slashing and quickness, but for his ability to get off his shot when it's needed the most. Actually, his willingness to take charge and find ways to score when his team needs it the most. The traits you mentioned, gfy, can all be easily compensated by a team effort.

gfy
12-08-2006, 05:49 PM
Of course my evaluation is based on current lineups. This all started when someone said that there's no way UE will beat DLSU in this tourney. I saw UE demolish their opponents even with their second unit(they had the same opponents). I don't disagree that teamwork and execution are essential but it's always a plus if one has a go-to-guy or two in their lineup. Coach Franz certainly will fill up the holes but right now I only see Villanueva, Casio, T@ng and Maierhofer as their all-around and dependable players. I was happy to see Ken Barracoso finally making those penetrations in the game against UP. He even had some reverse layups. Because that's what Ateneo needs from its wingmen. Same with DLSU in my opinion.

Let's just wait after the DLSU-UE semis. Things will be clearer by then insofar as weaknesses and strengths of each team are concerned.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-09-2006, 12:54 AM
Of course my evaluation is based on current lineups. This all started when someone said that there's no way UE will beat DLSU in this tourney. I saw UE demolish their opponents even with their second unit(they had the same opponents). I don't disagree that teamwork and execution are essential but it's always a plus if one has a go-to-guy or two in their lineup. Coach Franz certainly will fill up the holes but right now I only see Villanueva, Casio, T@ng and Maierhofer as their all-around and dependable players. I was happy to see Ken Barracoso finally making those penetrations in the game against UP. He even had some reverse layups. Because that's what Ateneo needs from its wingmen. Same with DLSU in my opinion.

Let's just wait after the DLSU-UE semis. Things will be clearer by then insofar as weaknesses and strengths of each team are concerned.


How the hell were you able to inject Ateneo in your supposed to be UE and La Salle discussion? LOL.

gfy
12-09-2006, 06:31 AM
^^ Read again. Trying to be smarter than some of the guys at your site? I've said that, except for Villanueva, your guys especially in the 2 and 3 positions need to penetrate and slash more. That's my opinion of course.

Vagged - I will tell you what Pilo said to me after the game. Baka magalit si Mr. Pumaren.

BTW who exactly is your go-to guy now? Ateneo has also lost JC and Macky. Re the press, my observation is it's harder for you now to break the press again because of the departure of Yeo and Arana. That's my opinion of course.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-09-2006, 12:54 PM
BTW who exactly is your go-to guy now? Ateneo has also lost JC and Macky. Re the press, my observation is it's harder for you now to break the press again because of the departure of Yeo and Arana. That's my opinion of course.


gfy, madaming paraan to break the press (ever since pine-press din naman kami), it's just a matter of execution and kundisyon ng utak especially pag andyan ka na sa situation na may dalawa o tatlong tao na huma-harass sa iyo. Putting strategies aside, proper mind set at walang kabog sa kalaban ang isa sa mga secrets on how to effectively break a pressure defense because how perfect it may be sa practice, pag kinabog ka na come gametime, puro turnover pa rin ang bagsak ng team.

Siguro mahihirapan kami pero magagawan ng paraan for sure.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-09-2006, 02:18 PM
GFY, we don't have a go-to-guy. We'll take the man who's hot or who is steady during the endgame stretch but actually we don't have a real go-to-guy. Maybe another reason is we have a cast of veterans who could help lead the team during crucial stretches in the game. The Archers play as a team, win as a team and lose as a team. We can live with the fact that we have no go to guy as long as the Archers help each other during close stretches for the win. I think five's better than one or two, don't you think so?

gfy
12-09-2006, 11:54 PM
You always went to Joseph in crucial moments. Now I don't see anybody who can really take his place. Casio is a bit small while Villanueva isn't really that consistent and creative yet. So you really have to depend on team effort and your system.

Now some unsolicited advice on your game against UE. You need to stop the short, medium and long range jumpers of Borboran, Espiritu, Gregorio, Canizares, Thiele, and Acuna. How? I don't know because the shots by these tall and quick guys are, as I have said, virtually impossible to block. These guys can also play inside, alley hoops included. Marcy should also be contained. Watch out too for the fastbreaks by Gregorio and Marcy. Their other guards like Bandaying can also shoot the treys. And if James Martinez gets hot ...

Kid Cubao
12-10-2006, 05:02 PM
hehehe, i've never heard of a defensive game plan that will allow the opponent to shoot at will ;D

alam na nila ang kailangang gawin sa ganyang sitwasyon. UE is a team of BIG-TIME CHOKERS, and if they feel the game is slipping from their grip, asahan mong magka-kanya-kanya ang mga yan. now i'm not saying that UE is sure to lose from this encounter (there's no such thing as absolute certainty in the world except death, the likelihood for change, and taxes), but i've never been high with UE with the composition they have. for UE to win, jorel cainizares will have to take charge at the guard spots. dito mhihirapan ang la salle because of jorel's height and versatility. problem is, dindo still doesn't seem to feel the need to unleash jorel. masyado pa rin syang bilib kina marcy, james martinez, and borboran.

if the game is kept tight, i'd pick la salle to win. for UE to win, it is important for them to pile the points while they can so that the green archers will run out of time whittling it down in the 4th.

gfy
12-10-2006, 08:17 PM
Kid - My observations are based on the ff:

1. The UE PBL guys have improved considerably (particularly shooting) over the past 2 months since the UAAP. I watched all the UE games in the Homegrown Cup and even the PBL games. Thiele and Llagas have improved too. Fampulme is a banger who will make Ilad, Walsham and Batricevic lose their cool. Marcy is now being used as pg in the PBL so he can also play pg in Coach Dindo's lineup. Didn't I mention before that he had Marcy, Canizares, Gregorio, Borboran and Espiritu on the floor at one time? The other guys like Acuna and Etrone also show potential. Marcy and James Martinez are a very lethal combination. What may be suspect are the other guards (Custodio and Lagabala are gone) but they will also improve including Lee who was Salamat's teammate at Baste. Overall Coach Dindo has many options to choose from. Coach Dindo is making sure that his players play as a team from the good ball movement and various plays I've seen so far. Of course bilog ang bola but I pick UE to win. If you don't know, Mr. and Mrs. Pilo Pumaren watch all their sons' games even outside the UAAP.


2. To me, DLSU hasn't shown the same defensive intensity like before. Of course they will also improve. Maierhofer and Ilad are good but Walsham, Co and Batricevic are still kind of slow. For this upcoming game at least, UE has the edge in manpower and shooting. To make up for these, DLSU will have to do better in rebounding.

Next year will be different. DLSU has good potential in Malabes and Barua. And in Batricevic and Walsham if they shape up. That's my layman's analysis, not too technical of course like yours. Well layman's however may not be exactly accurate because I ask around - coaches, assistant coaches and people who watch the games like Mr. Pilo Pumaren.

dunkerslam
12-11-2006, 12:39 AM
2. To me, DLSU hasn't shown the same defensive intensity like before. Of course they will also improve. Maierhofer and Ilad are good but Walsham, Co and Batricevic are still kind of slow. For this upcoming game at least, UE has the edge in manpower and shooting. To make up for these, DLSU will have to do better in rebounding.

Next year will be different. DLSU has good potential in Malabes and Barua. And in Batricevic and Walsham if they shape up. That's my layman's analysis, not too technical of course like yours. Well layman's however may not be exactly accurate because I ask around - coaches, assistant coaches and people who watch the games like Mr. Pilo Pumaren.


Atkins from DLSZ is under the radar. He hasn't been playing well. But believe you me- I've seen him play in scrimmage (at DLSZ), the guy has a side step that rivals Manu Ginobli. He'll be a great player next year. I just hope Franz gives him a chance.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-11-2006, 10:01 AM
gfy, IMHO, di pa kaya ni Fampulme na sirain diskarte ng kahit na sinong current big man namin. Si Fampulme ang puedeng masiraan ng bait sa loob pag di umubra yung mga "da bull" moves niya.

gfy
12-11-2006, 01:03 PM
^^ Hehe. How about Ilad? I watched the replays of the two DLSU games yesterday. Correct me if I am wrong but I noticed a number of Archers did attempt to penetrate but several times were called for offensive or just lost the ball (Ateneo din of course). If Atkins does have those moves, then he'll be very valuable to the Archers.

nel
12-11-2006, 01:12 PM
Yup, count all that to the rust from the long layoff as well as unfamiliarity with each other. A few games won't bring back the tight cohesion and game-time reflexes of the Archers that we've been used to in past Archer teams. They're a long way from being UAAP-ready. If the UAAP were to be held next month, we might not even make the final 4.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-11-2006, 01:45 PM
gfy, mas madaling ma-control si Brian compared kay Fampulme.

gfy
12-12-2006, 07:04 AM
My suggestions for tomorrow's game:

1. Your big men should be aggressive. In penetrating. And in rebounding both offensive and defensive.

2. Pressing defense throughout. UE has so many excellent shooters that once they get into their comfort zone DLSU can kiss the game goodbye.

3. Except for Villanueva, your guards and small forwards should forget about penetrating UE's tall defenses.

4. This is where you will particularly need your system - efficient ball movement and so forth.

5. Pray that your shooters - Casio, Tang, Malabes and Barua - will have 90% accuracy.

nel
12-12-2006, 07:42 AM
Good points, but I disagree about the bit on anyone but Cholo should not think of penetrating. Also, our shooters don't need to be 90% accurate for us to have a chance at winning. If they hit 30-40% of their shots, the UE defense will be stretched, and this will open up the middle for our other slashers like Casio, Barua and even Rico as well as our bigs like Walsham and Ilad. Watch what happens when our gunners like OJ, Bader, JV, and TY hit a couple of treys.

You're assuming that UE will be able to execute their game plan and our team won't be able to do anything but react to whatever the Warriors do. You forget that we do have a good bunch of coaches, who are more than capable of devising a plan which may end up derailing whatever the opponents have lined up. As an example, look at the game plan our coaches drew up two UAAP seasons ago which essentially attacked the perceived strength of the Ateneo interior defense anchored on Japeth. The success of that ploy more or less decided the outcome of the game because of the success, surprise and shock value it generated. Our coaching staff has the decided edge vs UE as far as experience and track record are concerned, and they know what to expect from their UE counterparts. They've thoroughly scouted the competition, and I'm sure they'll have something up their sleeve for this game. But I'm not going to speculate about what might happen - I'll leave the game plans to the coaches and just plan to enjoy the game. Heck, if it was as simple as we (you and I) armchair analysts make it out to be, we'd be coaching in the PBA by now.

UE is definitely a good team, but the end result of the game will depend as much on which team can impose its will and game plan on the other. UE may have the edge in player manpower and skills, but the Archers' braintrust has the experience and track record. I'd say we have an even chance.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-12-2006, 09:53 AM
You're assuming that UE will be able to execute their game plan and our team won't be able to do anything but react to whatever the Warriors do. You forget that we do have a good bunch of coaches, who are more than capable of devising a plan which may end up derailing whatever the opponents have lined up. As an example, look at the game plan our coaches drew up two UAAP seasons ago which essentially attacked the perceived strength of the Ateneo interior defense anchored on Japeth. The success of that ploy more or less decided the outcome of the game because of the success, surprise and shock value it generated. Our coaching staff has the decided edge vs UE as far as experience and track record are concerned, and they know what to expect from their UE counterparts. They've thoroughly scouted the competition, and I'm sure they'll have something up their sleeve for this game. But I'm not going to speculate about what might happen - I'll leave the game plans to the coaches and just plan to enjoy the game. Heck, if it was as simple as we (you and I) armchair analysts make it out to be, we'd be coaching in the PBA by now.

UE is definitely a good team, but the end result of the game will depend as much on which team can impose its will and game plan on the other. UE may have the edge in player manpower and skills, but the Archers' braintrust has the experience and track record. I'd say we have an even chance.


This is what I am trying to point out in one of my previous posts that we are not that stupid (for the lack of better term) not to impose our game plan (i.e. instead of us reacting to UE game plan, we let UE react to what we want to do with them) on UE and letting them think on what to do against us. I feel that the game tomorrow will be full of adjustments depending on how the team is acting inside, even if one team pulls in the first quarter, there may be chances that the other team can still catch up, adjust, and eventually win the game in the end.

I see it that the game may be decided in the 2nd half and I have to agree that our perimeter game should click so that we can work out on our half court game in case that we cannot score points off UE turnovers. I still think that we are the underdogs tomorrow due to the improvements of UE's main players. If they play in their elements tomorrow, mahihirapan tayo pero laban lang and let's see what will happen.

glock23
12-12-2006, 04:06 PM
^^ Some people were saying that DLSU's team is strong and will be hard to beat. And it will be stronger by next year. I just wanted to show the other side of the coin. The same way I and other Ateneans gave our honest opinion of our own team.

Well here's the final rub. I asked Mr. Pumaren (the father) today who he thinks will win the DLSU-UE semis. He told me and by how many points. Hint: He said that Yeo is a great loss to La Salle.


gfy, i just dont like the sound of your statement about pilo pumaren telling you who will win and by how many points! let us know now what he told you so we can see if its true. feeling ko lang, pinasakay ka lang ni coach. ;D

gfy
12-12-2006, 07:57 PM
Nel - I was kidding about the 90%. Nobody shoots 90%. But your outside shooting should really click tomorrow. Re penetrations by your guards and sfs, if they are part of a play ending in drop passes or kickouts for example, ok. But if they are drives to the basket, UE will just swat them away most of the time.

Mr. Pilo Pumaren said this - "Pag panalo, tambak." I took it to mean that if UE gets into its comfort zone as I mentioned UE will pull away. But if DLSU makes the necessary adjustments as you and BFB say and not let them get into their comfort zone then it will be an interesting match.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-13-2006, 01:04 AM
^^ Some people were saying that DLSU's team is strong and will be hard to beat. And it will be stronger by next year. I just wanted to show the other side of the coin. The same way I and other Ateneans gave our honest opinion of our own team.

Well here's the final rub. I asked Mr. Pumaren (the father) today who he thinks will win the DLSU-UE semis. He told me and by how many points. Hint: He said that Yeo is a great loss to La Salle.


gfy, i just dont like the sound of your statement about pilo pumaren telling you who will win and by how many points! let us know now what he told you so we can see if its true. feeling ko lang, pinasakay ka lang ni coach. ;D


Alam mo gfy, feeling ko din, feelingero ka. Hehehe biro lang. :D

oca
12-13-2006, 12:11 PM
We are about 7 months away from the next UAAP season. At this time, does it really matter at what percentage a team is from its full potential? If, at all, that can be objectively measured or assessed.

To a non-alligned poster like me, what I see in DLSU are just two things.

1.Franz Pumaren.
2.Opponents are intimidated by the DLSU mystique. I doubt if others would admit this.

Even during the years the the Archers lack a good rotation of big men. They have beaten taller lineups. Even during the years that they have few scorers, they were still hard to beat.

Why so?

All boils down to "on court execution". Here, the players become the decisive factor. It's becomes a players' game. The coaches are just on the sidelines.

Come crunch time, it is a question of who believes they will convert or make a stop. From where I sit, the Archers excudes that character.

Of the teams that have won the championships over the Archers in recent years, there were singular players whose skills are complemented by strenght of character. The kind who* cannot be intimidated. Those qualities influenced and lifted their teams to win- Fonacier of Ateneo and Santos of FEU.

Kahit lamang ka sa tao, kung papasok ka sa court thinking na mahirap talunin ang DLSU, tiyak talo ka. Pero kung may materiales kang pwedeng ilaban, at nanduon yung paniniwala na kaya mong talunin ang DLSU, tatalunin mo.

Really, the kind of "indoctrination which Pumaren does on the players" is what makes DLSU the team that it is. It's not the recruitment. It's not the press. DLSU does not have a monopoly on recruitment. Their brand of press can be and has been replicated. It's more than the Xs and Os.

It's the character. Oncourt character.

Yan ng dapat tapatan ng kalaban.

glock23
12-13-2006, 02:03 PM
We are about 7 months away from the next UAAP season. At this time, does it really matter at what percentage a team is from its full potential? If, at all, that can be objectively measured or assessed.

To a non-alligned poster like me, what I see in DLSU are just two things.

1.Franz Pumaren.
2.Opponents are intimidated by the DLSU mystique. I doubt if others would admit this.

Even during the years the the Archers lack a good rotation of big men. They have beaten taller lineups. Even during the years that they have few scorers, they were still hard to beat.

Why so?

All boils down to "on court execution". Here, the players become the decisive factor. It's becomes a players' game. The coaches are just on the sidelines.

Come crunch time, it is a question of who believes they will convert or make a stop. From where I sit, the Archers excudes that character.

Of the teams that have won the championships over the Archers in recent years, there were singular players whose skills are complemented by strenght of character. The kind who* cannot be intimidated. Those qualities influenced and lifted their teams to win- Fonacier of Ateneo and Santos of FEU.

Kahit lamang ka sa tao, kung papasok ka sa court thinking na mahirap talunin ang DLSU, tiyak talo ka. Pero kung may materiales kang pwedeng ilaban, at nanduon yung paniniwala na kaya mong talunin ang DLSU, tatalunin mo.

Really, the kind of "indoctrination which Pumaren does on the players" is what makes DLSU the team that it is. It's not the recruitment. It's not the press. DLSU does not have a monopoly on recruitment. Their brand of press can be and has been replicated. It's more than the Xs and Os.

It's the character. Oncourt character.

Yan ng dapat tapatan ng kalaban.



Oca, i couldnt agree with you more! i wrote in another site that the confidence, arrogance and swagger that the archers show on court is what makes them winners. They play each game knowing that they can beat any oppnent they meet, and that instills fear in others. Tama ang sinabi mo that for others to beat lasalle, dapat di ka takot. Ateneo players in my opinion have this fear of lasalle because despite a far superior line up in season 68 they were trounced by the archers in all games played that year. Great analysis pareng oca..... di kaya ikaw si coach franz? he he

dunkerslam
12-13-2006, 06:02 PM
Nel - I was kidding about the 90%. Nobody shoots 90%. But your outside shooting should really click tomorrow. Re penetrations by your guards and sfs, if they are part of a play ending in drop passes or kickouts for example, ok. But if they are drives to the basket, UE will just swat them away most of the time.

Mr. Pilo Pumaren said this - "Pag panalo, tambak." I took it to mean that if UE gets into its comfort zone as I mentioned UE will pull away. But if DLSU makes the necessary adjustments as you and BFB say and not let them get into their comfort zone then it will be an interesting match.


Sisiw. No match. Walang kwenta. Hehehehehe ;D

cub
12-13-2006, 06:22 PM
Nel - I was kidding about the 90%. Nobody shoots 90%. But your outside shooting should really click tomorrow. Re penetrations by your guards and sfs, if they are part of a play ending in drop passes or kickouts for example, ok. But if they are drives to the basket, UE will just swat them away most of the time.

Mr. Pilo Pumaren said this - "Pag panalo, tambak." I took it to mean that if UE gets into its comfort zone as I mentioned UE will pull away. But if DLSU makes the necessary adjustments as you and BFB say and not let them get into their comfort zone then it will be an interesting match.


hahaha! tambak UE! :P

brian
12-13-2006, 06:39 PM
Nel - I was kidding about the 90%. Nobody shoots 90%. But your outside shooting should really click tomorrow. Re penetrations by your guards and sfs, if they are part of a play ending in drop passes or kickouts for example, ok. But if they are drives to the basket, UE will just swat them away most of the time.

Mr. Pilo Pumaren said this - "Pag panalo, tambak." I took it to mean that if UE gets into its comfort zone as I mentioned UE will pull away. But if DLSU makes the necessary adjustments as you and BFB say and not let them get into their comfort zone then it will be an interesting match.


hahaha! tambak UE!* :P


tama pala sabi ni pilo pumaren baligtad lang ang paglaintindi ni gfy...as usual he he! ;D

gfy
12-13-2006, 09:18 PM
That's what he really said. He didn't anticipate that Coach Dindo will start with a second unit and continued with it for quite a while and substituted one by one instead of putting in his first five immediately. Maybe overconfidence that his team could easily catch up. But with DLSU you'll never know. A 20 point deficit at the start changes the complexion of the game. And to compound UE's misery, their shooting went south especially Martinez and Arellano while DLSU's was near perfect. The pressing defense and the stellar performance of Maierhofer and Ilad took its toll on the Warriors. And as I said before, UE's tall men are a little slow on defense which DLSU's big men and even Casio thoroughly exploited. Congrats.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-13-2006, 10:17 PM
Scripted pala ang laro gfy eh. Lumabas lahat ng nangyari sa laro ayon sa sinabi ni Mang Pilo. :D

brian
12-13-2006, 10:40 PM
That's what he really said. He didn't anticipate that Coach Dindo will start with a second unit and continued with it for quite a while and substituted one by one instead of putting in his first five immediately. Maybe overconfidence that his team could easily catch up. But with DLSU you'll never know. A 20 point deficit at the start changes the complexion of the game. And to compound UE's misery, their shooting went south especially Martinez and Arellano while DLSU's was near perfect. The pressing defense and the stellar performance of Maierhofer and Ilad took its toll on the Warriors. And as I said before, UE's tall men are a little slow on defense which DLSU's big men and even Casio thoroughly exploited. Congrats.


so now you're saying that we were playing ue's second unit all along...well, very nice.. splendid analysis indeed!

btw, all the things you said we did to win the game, well, you did earlier mention we just couldn't do? didn't you...

animo la salle!

david64
12-13-2006, 11:06 PM
I remember several incursions into the shaded lane by the Archers small men, Casio, Cholo, Bader and Barua-not to mention Ilad and Rico. These were not off passes, but were individual penetrations. They were scoring inside quite easily-I was waiting for the shots to be "swatted" away, but that did not happen.

I also thought we scored a lot on fastbreaks, not just by Rico and Cholo. I think a few other Archers contributed. And this team is supposed to be 'slow'. I also felt our press was a little more effective than UE's.

BTW, scoring for the Archers-Bader=16, Rico=13, Casio=11, Tang=8, Ilad=7.

chinky_06
12-14-2006, 12:52 AM
I wasn't expecting that the there would be an almost 20-point gap in the scores... This only proves that DLSU team is more than ready for the 70th UAAP. Maierhofer is great as well as Ilad!!! hehehe! G0 DLSU!!!

Fried Green Tomato
12-14-2006, 01:53 AM
To a non-alligned poster like me, what I see in DLSU are just two things.

1.Franz Pumaren.
2.Opponents are intimidated by the DLSU mystique. I doubt if others would admit this.

Even during the years the the Archers lack a good rotation of big men. They have beaten taller lineups. Even during the years that they have few scorers, they were still hard to beat.

Why so?

All boils down to "on court execution". Here, the players become the decisive factor. It's becomes a players' game. The coaches are just on the sidelines.

Come crunch time, it is a question of who believes they will convert or make a stop. From where I sit, the Archers excudes that character.

Of the teams that have won the championships over the Archers in recent years, there were singular players whose skills are complemented by strenght of character. The kind who* cannot be intimidated. Those qualities influenced and lifted their teams to win- Fonacier of Ateneo and Santos of FEU.

Kahit lamang ka sa tao, kung papasok ka sa court thinking na mahirap talunin ang DLSU, tiyak talo ka. Pero kung may materiales kang pwedeng ilaban, at nanduon yung paniniwala na kaya mong talunin ang DLSU, tatalunin mo.

Really, the kind of "indoctrination which Pumaren does on the players" is what makes DLSU the team that it is. It's not the recruitment. It's not the press. DLSU does not have a monopoly on recruitment. Their brand of press can be and has been replicated. It's more than the Xs and Os.

It's the character. Oncourt character.

Yan ng dapat tapatan ng kalaban.


You got it right. And it would take a non-alligned poster to bluntly point out what we've been saying and doing for the longest time (di nga lang namin masabi ng diretso at baka sabihin arogante kami :D)

From the very start, the players know that they have to play within the system - live & die with the system. Once they openly accept it, execution is not a difficult task; the players flow with ease and grace executing the defined system. And as the players gain confidence and faith to the system, it is inevitable to achieve oncourt character. When the players achieved complete faith with the system, fear of the opponent becomes a non-factor at all. But even with such oncourt character, we always give due respect to our opponent; that on any given day they could beat us if we take them for granted. In short, we try to keep everything within the reality of what we have. We adjust if necessary to compensate for our weakness and do things, most of the time, within the comfort zone of our system.


As for the recruitment, you are right. We don't have the monopoly on recruitment. We don't usually get the best players available within the radar screen of others but IT IS A MUST for us to get players that we think would fit well to our system.

nel
12-14-2006, 07:58 AM
That's what's nice about the system. Adherence to the system is one thing you can expect from the Archers game-in, game-out. They're prepared for most opponents' set-up, and have extensively practiced their plays against the different scenarios they expect to encounter. For each game, it's just a matter of choosing from the coaches' bag of tricks, and during game time, making the necessary adjustments as the need arises. Most of the time, the Archers' discipline in following the game plan allows them to impose their will on the opponents. That's half the battle right there.

Yesterday's results notwithstanding, I disagree with chinky_06's conclusion that the Archers are more than ready for next season. Far from it. I doubt if their current physical conditioning will allow them to play the same way if the format were like the UAAP's. If this were the UAAP, we might not even make the final 4.

We're probably lucky that the opponents haven't really prepared for the tournament, or have not fielded their strongest teams. Look at how the reigning UAAP and NCAA champions got booted out very quickly. Coy Banal wasn't even coaching the Red Lions, and their best players weren't playing. UST had a difficult time juggling players between the PBL and the Homegrown Cup, and their lack of focus was obvious. At this point in time, the Archers are hungrier for competition than the opponents, show more determination, and want it more.

There are still a lot of rough spots. Teamwork and that traditional (almost instinctive) familiarity with each other's moves isn't there yet, as seen in the blown passes and numerous offensive rebounds the opponents had. The coaches are still experimenting with how to utilize each player's respective strengths within the system. There's a lot of fine tuning still to be done. Problem is, every team is now preparing like them for next season this early.

=============================

gfy,

Nice try at prognostication. I guess our coaches saw your analysis and decided to show a few cards they may have hidden. From accounts of those who watched the game, we hit a lot of outside shots (not 90% though), and there were numerous fastbreaks and lane incursions even by those Archers not known to be "slashers". I heard that Cholo wasn't even there for the start of the game when they raced to that 18-0 lead. For whatever reason, the Archers got the jump on UE at the start, and that was the game. I think the closest UE got was within 6 points in the first half, then the Archers pulled away and kept the Warriors at bay.

It's how the coaches prepare the team for each game, and how the team executes the plan that will determine the results, not the physical attributes like speed. Basketball is also a thinking man's game, and a well-executed plan will probably decide the results. In the case of the Archers, we may not have the best individual talents on our team, but this is one case where the whole (the team playing as one and executing the plan) is greater than the sum of the parts (individual skills).

So, what's your prediction for Sunday's championship game? Any previews you'd care to share? It'll be interesting to match your pre-game analysis with the results. Who knows - if the coaches see your prediction, they may just decide to prove your wrong again.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-14-2006, 08:14 AM
From what I've seen in the game yesterday, mabagal tayo at walang slashers kaya ang umpisa 18-0 hehehe.

Seriously speaking, maybe Dindo was overconfident with DLSU's one point win during the scrimmage match. UE lost by just 1 point with a weaker lineup during that scrimmage match so maybe inisip niya na kaya nilang makipag-sabayan sa DLSU starting his projected prospects. DLSU played them hard from the initial stretch. Kita mo yung physicality in a way on how DLSU players "bump" the UE players which made it hard for the UE guards to set up their offense.

Off din ang start ng UE yesterday, kung ano yung high energy ng DLSU nung 1st quater, it was the exact opposite of how UE played. They played very, very flat and kahit na ipinasok na ni coach Dindo yung strongest lineup niya, di na kaya habulin because of the large margin that was set up early on. DLSU also defended well on screens set up to free their usual perimeter suspects like Bandaying, Martinez, and Arellano. All shots were challenged which resulted to those UE guys to miss their perimeter shots.

I do really think that we should play at the highest possible energy that we can against JRU. Nakita na natin how they play us last December 3 and malamang mauulit ang pattern ng tawagan nyan on Sunday (meaning it will be a no blood, no foul affair) kaya we should at least get prepared and anticipate itong mga pangyayaring ito. We should also avoid foul trouble early on so that we can set our pace and dictate the tempo of the game.

oca
12-14-2006, 10:22 AM
I think Dindo was just simply arrogant not to call an early timeout and immediately put his best five in the game. Ayaw mapahiya or makantiyawan.

From 0-18, against DLSU, pag nilamangan ka na nang ganyan, mag-iiba ang mindset ng mga bata. Whatever advantage you have in your line-up, wala na yun pag malaki na ang hahabulin mo.

As for DLSU, with that big early lead, ano pa nga ba ang gagawin but to play its "usual game". The big cushion only made them more confident and enabled them to move well on court, thus creating scoring opportunites for many.

The thing I appreciate the most in this game is- for DLSU - not once "bumaba yung level ng laro nila". Kahit malaki yung lamang, hanggang endgame, they played at "that level". Hindi madaling gawin yun. Takes a lot of discipline -- individually and colletively--- for one to do that.

Kid Cubao
12-14-2006, 10:59 AM
for me, it's clear as day: the UE warriors choking at the most inopportune times is almost as certain as day follows night. we've seen this pattern in the UAAP even in the days of nino canaleta, james yap, and paul artadi, and even back in the 80s. mental toughness is something they sorely need to work on. no need to break this down and examine with magnifying lenses.

second, coach franz takes his head to head matchups with dindo personally ever since their "tampuhan" in season 68, when the green archer coach learned about UE's protest in the papers--remember the wild and wooly game held at the blue eagle gym wherein the red warriors successfully protested the supposed cholo villanueva game-winner?

experience tells us that intangibles mean everything in big games like these. congrats to la salle.

LION
12-14-2006, 11:08 AM
Congratulations to La Salle.

Based on the game yesterday, it seems that JRU is the worthier rival for DLSU in this series. Mas nahirapan pa ang La Salle sa JRU kesa sa UE. And you can see that JRU really wants to win this one.

Now this will be an exciting finals. Will watch the game and the side events. ;D

lekiboy
12-14-2006, 11:49 AM
To a non-alligned poster like me, what I see in DLSU are just two things.

1.Franz Pumaren.
2.Opponents are intimidated by the DLSU mystique. I doubt if others would admit this.

Even during the years the the Archers lack a good rotation of big men. They have beaten taller lineups. Even during the years that they have few scorers, they were still hard to beat.

Why so?

All boils down to "on court execution". Here, the players become the decisive factor. It's becomes a players' game. The coaches are just on the sidelines.

Come crunch time, it is a question of who believes they will convert or make a stop. From where I sit, the Archers excudes that character.

Of the teams that have won the championships over the Archers in recent years, there were singular players whose skills are complemented by strenght of character. The kind who* cannot be intimidated. Those qualities influenced and lifted their teams to win- Fonacier of Ateneo and Santos of FEU.

Kahit lamang ka sa tao, kung papasok ka sa court thinking na mahirap talunin ang DLSU, tiyak talo ka. Pero kung may materiales kang pwedeng ilaban, at nanduon yung paniniwala na kaya mong talunin ang DLSU, tatalunin mo.

Really, the kind of "indoctrination which Pumaren does on the players" is what makes DLSU the team that it is. It's not the recruitment. It's not the press. DLSU does not have a monopoly on recruitment. Their brand of press can be and has been replicated. It's more than the Xs and Os.

It's the character. Oncourt character.

Yan ng dapat tapatan ng kalaban.


You got it right. And it would take a non-alligned poster to bluntly point out what we've been saying and doing for the longest time (di nga lang namin masabi ng diretso at baka sabihin arogante kami :D)

From the very start, the players know that they have to play within the system - live & die with the system. Once they openly accept it, execution is not a difficult task; the players flow with ease and grace executing the defined system. And as the players gain confidence and faith to the system, it is inevitable to achieve oncourt character. When the players achieved complete faith with the system, fear of the opponent becomes a non-factor at all. But even with such oncourt character, we always give due respect to our opponent; that on any given day they could beat us if we take them for granted. In short, we try to keep everything within the reality of what we have. We adjust if necessary to compensate for our weakness and do things, most of the time, within the comfort zone of our system.


As for the recruitment, you are right. We don't have the monopoly on recruitment. We don't usually get the best players available within the radar screen of others but IT IS A MUST for us to get players that we think would fit well to our system.



Sorry guys...pero medyo vague sa akin yung so called DLSU "mystique". It just doesn't ring a bell for the Red Army. This mystique may apply to the UAAP teams only. I may be wrong but I think my observation is a result of the lack of games versus SBC and DLSU....team As. Another one is the issue on history, tradition and cheers. I think there is not much initimidating factor for us Bedans. We are more into tradition, history and pride that goes with basketball.....

Mas marami pa yatang games ang HS and GS teams ng La Salle and SAn Beda...and usually in these games since the 80s...we blow the greenies into pieces...Zobel, Greenhills or wherever...PRADA, MMBL, Nationals, Milo and now, the NCAA... there were games when the Mighty Red Cubs lead as much as 3X and 2X in PRADA and Milo....

It wil take years maybe for the DLSU team to develop that mytique with us.... or even centuries... :):):)

LION
12-14-2006, 12:20 PM
^^^ Oca is talking about the DLSU "mystique" in the UAAP only and does not therefore apply to SBC and the other NCAA teams. Perhaps JRU is the better example. This NCAA team is not aware/conscious of the DLSU "mystique" thus, the JRU players are "not affected" at all.

nel
12-14-2006, 12:27 PM
lekiboy,

It's understandable that you might get that impression because you probably never saw the NCAA competitions in the 70s when both La Salle and Ateneo were still with the NCAA. Before you make sweeping generalizations based on limited experience or observations, I suggest you check with those who are more familiar with traditions, particularly the older Bedans. Just because you never knew about traditions of some schools before doesn't mean that they didn't exist. San Beda's faithful always sing your Alma Mater song after each game. Are you aware that La Salle was the first school to start this tradition? Your credibility is kinda suspect because of your obvious inexperience. Remember the poem "The Six Blind Men and the Elephant"?

I think you're in the wrong site if you want to start knocking other schools (try PEX instead), and you're definitely in the wrong gameface forum - this is the green area. We won't mind if you post your "superiority" comments in your own area, but suggest you rethink your venue if you want to claim any sort of advantage (real or otherwise) for your school. I'll leave it to our mod to decide how far he will allow this to go.

BTW, kindly check which schools have been competitive in PRADA in the last few years. If I'm not mistaken, LSGH won last school year's junior basketball competition. We recognize that SBC has a very good basketball program, but that doesn't mean that other schools are far behind. A little less hot air from you will be much appreciated.

gfy
12-14-2006, 12:34 PM
I don't know what Coach Dindo was thinking by fielding in his second unit at the start (Brian take note) but that 20-point lead (and against DLSU that's a no-no) had a huge effect on UE. Under pressure to overcome the lead, they were hurrying their shots. They also completely forgot about defense. They lost their focus and were not able to get into any comfort zone, any zone for that matter (maybe time zone :D). In the closing quarters, Dindo was trying everything if it will work. That is not to take anything away from DLSU's performance. But you think DLSU could repeat the same way? I don't think so. Those incursions by Casio and a few others (not your big men) I still believe will not be repeated as often as you did in that game. They practically had the highway all to themselves. They did not choke but suffocated on their own vomit* ;D.

Nel - JRU seems to be the hungrier team this time. If their outside shots will fall in like the game vs. FEU then it's going to be a hell-of-a-lot game.

And are some of you saying that you are better in analysis than Mr. Pilo? :D.

brian
12-14-2006, 12:44 PM
I think Dindo was just simply arrogant not to call an early timeout and immediately put his best five in the game. Ayaw mapahiya or makantiyawan.

From 0-18, against DLSU, pag nilamangan ka na nang ganyan, mag-iiba ang mindset ng mga bata. Whatever advantage you have in your line-up, wala na yun pag malaki na ang hahabulin mo.

As for DLSU, with that big early lead, ano pa nga ba ang gagawin but to play its "usual game". The big cushion only made them more confident and enabled them to move well on court, thus creating scoring opportunites for many.

The thing I appreciate the most in this game is- for DLSU - not once "bumaba yung level ng laro nila". Kahit malaki yung lamang, hanggang endgame, they played at "that level". Hindi madaling gawin yun. Takes a lot of discipline -- individually and colletively--- for one to do that.


ue has beaten us in a prior game without their starters, due to this, perhaps dindo's mindset was for their second stringers to keep step then pull away upon entry of their starting line up....well, *it just didn't happen..

perhaps it was arrogance or just a strategy that's gone the other way...

i agree, the big cusion allowed dlsu to be more confident and move well on the court..and playing at the same level until endgame i probab;y attribute to our lesson learned playing jru, giving up a 17 point margin and even the lead, and luckily recovering in time..

the finals would still be a difficult task at hand...

brian
12-14-2006, 12:48 PM
I don't know what Coach Dindo was thinking but that 20-point lead (and against DLSU that's a no-no) had a huge effect on UE. Under pressure to overcome the lead, they were hurrying their shots. They also completely forgot about defense. They lost their focus and were not able to get into any comfort zone, any zone for that matter (maybe time zone :D). In the closing quarters, Dindo was trying everything if it will work. That is not to take anything away from DLSU's performance. But you think DLSU could repeat the same way? I don't think so. Those incursions by Casio and a few others (not your big men) I still believe will not be repeated as often as you did in that game. They practically had the highway all to themselves. They did not choke but suffocated on their own vomit* ;D.


gfy,

mali ka na nga sa prediction mo, humihirit ka na ulit ha ha!....medyo pagpahingahin mo na muna ang isip mo he he!...

but of course you wouldn't know what dndo was thinking, much less so what you have in mind yourself, this i'm pretty sure of ha ha!..

flsfnoeraekadad
12-14-2006, 12:49 PM
I don't know what Coach Dindo was thinking but that 20-point lead (and against DLSU that's a no-no) had a huge effect on UE. Under pressure to overcome the lead, they were hurrying their shots. They also completely forgot about defense. They lost their focus and were not able to get into any comfort zone, any zone for that matter (maybe time zone :D). In the closing quarters, Dindo was trying everything if it will work. That is not to take anything away from DLSU's performance. But you think DLSU could repeat the same way? I don't think so. Those incursions by Casio and a few others (not your big men) I still believe will not be repeated as often as you did in that game. They practically had the highway all to themselves. They did not choke but suffocated on their own vomit ;D.

Are you making excuses for UE? This is getting nice! ;D

nel
12-14-2006, 12:55 PM
I don't know what Coach Dindo was thinking but that 20-point lead (and against DLSU that's a no-no) had a huge effect on UE. Under pressure to overcome the lead, they were hurrying their shots. They also completely forgot about defense. They lost their focus and were not able to get into any comfort zone, any zone for that matter (maybe time zone :D). In the closing quarters, Dindo was trying everything if it will work. That is not to take anything away from DLSU's performance. But you think DLSU could repeat the same way? I don't think so. Those incursions by Casio and a few others (not your big men) I still believe will not be repeated as often as you did in that game. They practically had the highway all to themselves. They did not choke but suffocated on their own vomit* ;D.


gfy,

mali ka na nga sa prediction mo, humihirit ka na ulit ha ha!....medyo pagpahingahin mo na muna ang isip mo he he!...



bri,

Actually, mas maganda nga when he predicts a difficult game for us, because the opposite usually happens.

I do have a slight problem with his line that kinda goes "they didn't beat us, we gave the game away". Oh well, his glass is half empty, while mine is half full.

lekiboy
12-14-2006, 12:55 PM
lekiboy,

It's understandable that you might get that impression because you probably never saw the NCAA competitions in the 70s when both La Salle and Ateneo were still with the NCAA. Before you make sweeping generalizations based on limited experience or observations, I suggest you check with those who are more familiar with traditions, particularly the older Bedans. Just because you never knew about traditions of some schools before doesn't mean that they didn't exist. Your credibility is kinda suspect because of your obvious inexperience. Remember the poem "The Six Blind Men and the Elephant".

I think you're in the wrong site if you want to start knocking other schools (try PEX instead), and you're definitely in the wrong gameface forum - this is the green area. We won't mind if you post your "superiority" comments in your own area, but suggest you rethink your venue if you want to claim any sort of advantage (real or otherwise) for your school. I'll leave it to our mod to decide how far he will allow this to go.

BTW, kindly check which schools have been competitive in PRADA in the last few years. If I'm not mistaken, LSGH won last school year's junior basketball competition. We recognize that SBC has a very good basketball program, but that doesn't mean that other schools are far behind. A little less hot air from you will be much appreciated.


Nel,
Masyado kang emotional.... i just presented the other side of the coin....if you cannot swallow it, don't. I even started my post with an apology. You are way too off from your premises. What I shared is a fact - there is no mystique of DLSU in the NCAA and in particular, * San Beda. We are talking about the Homegrown and NCAA teams are included there. Claim of advantage?


Don't even try to swell *gameface with euphemisms..... you do not own this site. Try to check if I *presented any flawed fact in my post:

1. SBC and DLSU not having enough games with each other. *Fact.
2. Red Cubs blowing greenies in the past decade....at least during my time. 2X and 3x...I was there in the games. Is this a sweeping generalization? This is the reason why you do not have a mystique.
3. There is no DLSU mystique in SBC. Fact.

I have substantial knowledge with the 70s as shared also by my seniors - and it is not DLSU and Ateneo. It is DLSU and Letran.


By the way, *yes LION is correct...only in the UAAP. Yun lang message ko. Di mo lang ba matanggap na wala kayong mystique sa amin?...Anyways, Congratulations sa inyo for reaching the finals. Drink less coffee.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-14-2006, 12:57 PM
3. There is no DLSU mystique in SBC. Fact.

And vice-versa.

lekiboy
12-14-2006, 12:59 PM
3. There is no DLSU mystique in SBC. Fact.

And vice-versa.


well accepted.

nel
12-14-2006, 01:06 PM
By the way, *yes LION is correct...only in the UAAP. Yun lang message ko. Di mo lang ba matanggap na wala kayong mystique sa amin?...Anyways, Congratulations sa inyo for reaching the finals. Drink less coffee.
.

I wish to protest - I've only had 4 cups of java today. hahaha. It's all good

bigfreeze_bibby
12-14-2006, 01:07 PM
Hey, hey guys cool down tayo dito. Relax lang, oca presented his opinion regarding the advantage of DLSU coming into different matches na nilalaro natin. Okay lang si lekiboy, he has a different view about it and walang problema dun. I don't see it na kailangan natin itong bigyan ng mahabang discussion. We think it's right, some may think it's not. Let's end it there, oks?

gfy, I believe that we can repeat that same performance against UE in every competitive match na maghaharap kami, no arrogance to be imposed here.

brian
12-14-2006, 02:00 PM
To a non-alligned poster like me, what I see in DLSU are just two things.

1.Franz Pumaren.
2.Opponents are intimidated by the DLSU mystique. I doubt if others would admit this.

Even during the years the the Archers lack a good rotation of big men. They have beaten taller lineups. Even during the years that they have few scorers, they were still hard to beat.

Why so?

All boils down to "on court execution". Here, the players become the decisive factor. It's becomes a players' game. The coaches are just on the sidelines.

Come crunch time, it is a question of who believes they will convert or make a stop. From where I sit, the Archers excudes that character.

Of the teams that have won the championships over the Archers in recent years, there were singular players whose skills are complemented by strenght of character. The kind who* cannot be intimidated. Those qualities influenced and lifted their teams to win- Fonacier of Ateneo and Santos of FEU.

Kahit lamang ka sa tao, kung papasok ka sa court thinking na mahirap talunin ang DLSU, tiyak talo ka. Pero kung may materiales kang pwedeng ilaban, at nanduon yung paniniwala na kaya mong talunin ang DLSU, tatalunin mo.

Really, the kind of "indoctrination which Pumaren does on the players" is what makes DLSU the team that it is. It's not the recruitment. It's not the press. DLSU does not have a monopoly on recruitment. Their brand of press can be and has been replicated. It's more than the Xs and Os.

It's the character. Oncourt character.

Yan ng dapat tapatan ng kalaban.


You got it right. And it would take a non-alligned poster to bluntly point out what we've been saying and doing for the longest time (di nga lang namin masabi ng diretso at baka sabihin arogante kami :D)

From the very start, the players know that they have to play within the system - live & die with the system. Once they openly accept it, execution is not a difficult task; the players flow with ease and grace executing the defined system. And as the players gain confidence and faith to the system, it is inevitable to achieve oncourt character. When the players achieved complete faith with the system, fear of the opponent becomes a non-factor at all. But even with such oncourt character, we always give due respect to our opponent; that on any given day they could beat us if we take them for granted. In short, we try to keep everything within the reality of what we have. We adjust if necessary to compensate for our weakness and do things, most of the time, within the comfort zone of our system.


As for the recruitment, you are right. We don't have the monopoly on recruitment. We don't usually get the best players available within the radar screen of others but IT IS A MUST for us to get players that we think would fit well to our system.



Sorry guys...pero medyo vague sa akin yung so called DLSU "mystique". It just doesn't ring a bell for the Red Army. This mystique may apply to the UAAP teams only. I may be wrong but I think my observation is a result of the lack of games versus SBC and DLSU....team As. Another one is the issue on history, tradition and cheers. I think there is not much initimidating factor for us Bedans. We are more into tradition, history and pride that goes with basketball.....

Mas marami pa yatang games ang HS and GS teams ng La Salle and SAn Beda...and usually in these games since the 80s...we blow the greenies into pieces...Zobel, Greenhills or wherever...PRADA, MMBL, Nationals, Milo and now, the NCAA... there were games when the Mighty Red Cubs lead as much as 3X and 2X in PRADA and Milo....

It wil take years maybe for the DLSU team to develop that mytique with us.... or even centuries... :):):)






lekiboy,

well siguro iba lang talaga ang dating when you say/claim that you are "more" into tradition, history and pride that goes with basketbal...i'm pretty certain we aren't lacking any of it.. but of course it is your opinion..

these kind of statements would surely stir anyone's morning coffee he he..peace! (btw, the rest is fine)

my take.

glock23
12-14-2006, 02:44 PM
Gfy, sabi ko na nga ba pinasakay ka lang ni coach pilo eh! ;D he knows you are from the ateneo and he will never give out information to someone who's school tried their best to malign his son during the height of the lasalle suspension. Cant wait for your analysis for our next game!

Fried Green Tomato
12-14-2006, 03:31 PM
Sorry guys...pero medyo vague sa akin yung so called DLSU "mystique". It just doesn't ring a bell for the Red Army. This mystique may apply to the UAAP teams only. I may be wrong but I think my observation is a result of the lack of games versus SBC and DLSU....team As. Another one is the issue on history, tradition and cheers. I think there is not much initimidating factor for us Bedans. We are more into tradition, history and pride that goes with basketball.....

Mas marami pa yatang games ang HS and GS teams ng La Salle and SAn Beda...and usually in these games since the 80s...we blow the greenies into pieces...Zobel, Greenhills or wherever...PRADA, MMBL, Nationals, Milo and now, the NCAA... there were games when the Mighty Red Cubs lead as much as 3X and 2X in PRADA and Milo....

It wil take years maybe for the DLSU team to develop that mytique with us.... or even centuries... :):):)


It's not surprising that you don't know the so-called "dlsu mystique" afterall your san beda is playing in the ncaa. But for member teams of the uaap, it''s one reality that has been happening since 1988 (1st time we got into the finals and a real contender for the uaap crown).

Lots have been said and written about La Salle basketball (good & bad depending from where you are coming of course) for two decades now and we may not win the crown all the time but we've always been a contender. And that two decades of basketball excellence is by no chance an accident and the other uaap teams are very aware that it is a reality that they have to face season after season. It is no surprising at all that all the other uaap teams prepare doubly hard whenever they meet us... beating us gives them extra pleasure if not absolute joy. For two decades now, if i may say so my own opinion, no other teams have accomplished such record in collegiate uaap or even ncaa. UST, San Sebastian, Letran had their share of dominance for a quite a number of years but they were not able to sustain it. No other teams were consistent and stable enough in the last two decades except for La Salle. And that consistency in basketball program gave an illusion of "dlsu mystique" in the uaap.

And we have no ambition of imposing the "dlsu mystique" to San Beda nor intention of intimidating the bedans afterall they are playing in a different league... it's useless and there is little bragging rights. And if we do meet them in some other tournaments, so be it but it's business as usual.

It would take years & years of real uaap basketball experience before you fully understand what the "dlsu mystique" is all about. It maybe real or not but bottomline, we don't care what others think. What is important is that the other uaap teams are fully aware of our presence, our relevance and our perceived "mystique" we have on them.

lekiboy
12-14-2006, 05:59 PM
now that's crystal.... ;)

Ranger
12-14-2006, 06:42 PM
No SBC mystique because in the last 10 years before this year, SBC was never in the radar screen. SBC was nowhere in the level of DLSU. We would have tune up games with SBC during summers ... do you really want to know by how much we used to massacre you guys? Just ask your past coaches...Rene Baena, Jonathan Reyes, Nash Racela...

gfy
12-14-2006, 08:55 PM
On the issue of incursions, your guys (not your big men) will be tested again vs. JRU's frontline. The JRU guards are not battle-tested but they have angas. DLSU will win this one (so expect the opposite to happen :P).

For whatever its worth, the father of Espiritu told me that the UE team didn't really have practices as a complete team because of the PBL. Even during their Homegrown games, some guys were missing. I guess we'll just have to wait for your next encounter vs. UE.

glock23
12-14-2006, 09:44 PM
On the issue of incursions, your guys (not your big men) will be tested again vs. JRU's frontline. The JRU guards are not battle-tested but they have angas. DLSU will win this one (so expect the opposite to happen* :P).

For whatever its worth, the father of Espiritu told me that the UE team didn't really have practices as a complete team because of the PBL. Even during their Homegrown games, some guys were missing. I guess we'll just have to wait for your next encounter vs. UE.


you are hilarious!!! from pilo pumaren telling you that ue will beat lasalle na "tambak" to suddenly the father of espiritu telling you that they didnt hold practices as a team because of the PBL. Biglang buwelta ka parekoy!

flsfnoeraekadad
12-14-2006, 10:00 PM
On the issue of incursions, your guys (not your big men) will be tested again vs. JRU's frontline. The JRU guards are not battle-tested but they have angas. DLSU will win this one (so expect the opposite to happen :P).

For whatever its worth, the father of Espiritu told me that the UE team didn't really have practices as a complete team because of the PBL. Even during their Homegrown games, some guys were missing. I guess we'll just have to wait for your next encounter vs. UE.


you are hilarious!!! from pilo pumaren telling you that ue will beat lasalle na "tambak" to suddenly the father of espiritu telling you that they didnt hold practices as a team because of the PBL. Biglang buwelta ka parekoy!


Ayoko na makinig sa mga komento ni gfy. Eh parang niloloko lang tayo nyan eh nyahaha.

gfy
12-14-2006, 11:08 PM
^^ Hehe. I saw the father of Espiritu (I know him) in today's PBL games at UST. I asked him why Dindo started with his second unit. He said he realy didn't know but one reason may be what I posted above. Next time tanungin ninyo si Mr. Pilo. Nandun yun Mrs. niya nang tanungin ko. Because we often saw each other during the FMC and the Champions League we got to talk a few times. Kung di kayo maniwala, bahala na sa inyo si Batman.* :D

Hmmm... People are saying na pinasakay lang ako ni Mr. Pilo. I don't think he even knows I am an Atenean. Kaya niya sinabi UE dahil gusto ko manalo ang UE? Geez... Medyo pinilit ko pa nga siya. Siyempre ayaw niya rin papiliin between UE and DLSU pero I wanted his opinion kasi expert siya.

So what can you say about Greenarrows' prognostication about the DLSU-UE game that it was too close to call? That he didn't know his basketball? Or the others like Rektikano's? Geez...

brian
12-15-2006, 06:42 AM
On the issue of incursions, your guys (not your big men) will be tested again vs. JRU's frontline. The JRU guards are not battle-tested but they have angas. DLSU will win this one (so expect the opposite to happen* :P).

For whatever its worth, the father of Espiritu told me that the UE team didn't really have practices as a complete team because of the PBL. Even during their Homegrown games, some guys were missing. I guess we'll just have to wait for your next encounter vs. UE.


you are hilarious!!! from pilo pumaren telling you that ue will beat lasalle na "tambak" to suddenly the father of espiritu telling you that they didnt hold practices as a team because of the PBL. Biglang buwelta ka parekoy!


Ayoko na makinig sa mga komento ni gfy. Eh parang niloloko lang tayo nyan eh nyahaha.


parang 2 years old kausap mo diba he he!

bigfreeze_bibby
12-15-2006, 06:51 AM
On the issue of incursions, your guys (not your big men) will be tested again vs. JRU's frontline. The JRU guards are not battle-tested but they have angas. DLSU will win this one (so expect the opposite to happen* :P).

For whatever its worth, the father of Espiritu told me that the UE team didn't really have practices as a complete team because of the PBL. Even during their Homegrown games, some guys were missing. I guess we'll just have to wait for your next encounter vs. UE.


Predict that we will lose! Please gfy, predict that we will lose hehehe.

Kid Cubao
12-15-2006, 07:49 AM
gfy, wala ka talagang kadala-dala hahaha!

pero this much i can say: your posts are very entertaining not only to our hardcore la salle baller brothers but to every one who visits gameface.ph. we all need to be able to throw back our heads in laughter every now and then, and because of you, posts that leave you gagging for air will never be in short supply in these pages ;D

LION
12-15-2006, 08:19 AM
No SBC mystique because in the last 10 years before this year, SBC was never in the radar screen. SBC was nowhere in the level of DLSU. We would have tune up games with SBC during summers ... do you really want to know by how much we used to massacre you guys? Just ask your past coaches...Rene Baena, Jonathan Reyes, Nash Racela...
*

I think the issue caused by lekiboy's post was already settled, until you you revived it.

You are right with regard to "used to" as the operative word* in describing the outcome of those tune up games.* *However, the 1978 finals should be the better gauge* because that event was more significant than the tune up games you mentioned.

Since this is your forum and Christmas is just around the corner, I will let you have the last word. :)

Merry Christmas!*

gfy
12-15-2006, 08:34 AM
Kid - I really don't care. You said "choke". Choke means you lose the ballgame at the last minute, tama ba? So UE choked the last time? They were already choking from the very first minute.* :D

Brian - So magaling ka mag-analyze? Gusto mo mag-predict ng JRU-DLSU game? You even thought that the 18-0 start didn't have anything to do at all with UE fielding their second unit.* :D

Bigfreeze - I predict that you will come back to do your gig at halftime. Hehehe.

brian
12-15-2006, 08:57 AM
Kid - I really don't care. You said "choke". Choke means you lose the ballgame at the last minute, tama ba? So UE choked the last time? They were already choking from the very first minute.* :D

Brian - So magaling ka mag-analyze? Gusto mo mag-predict ng JRU-DLSU game? You even thought that the 18-0 start didn't have anything to do at all with UE fielding their second unit.* :D


mmmm 18-0 start....the 18 points, well i suppose we did what we had to do at the onset..and you make it sound that the 0 start of ue had nothing to do with our defense?

ay mas magaling ka mag analyze sa akin gfy.. kumpleto ka with matching resource persons pa ha ha!....yun nga lang mali mga analysis mo ha ha!

as for the finals, jru would play wiith a lot of confidence and resolve in the first half. they may even lead at half time, however, they'd turn up empty come second half...in a close game, conditioning would play a great part in this game...dlsu by not more than 10..there!

but of course unlike you, i maybe wrong.. ::)

nel
12-15-2006, 09:48 AM
bri,

I agree with you that UE's poor start had to be attributed at least in part to how the Archers forced them to play. True, it might have been a coaching mistake not to start with the best 5 Warriors, but their starters in that game weren't any slouches, either. I think their lineup is solid up to the 10th or 11th man.

Reminds me of a famous line of one of tennis' Williams sisters (don't remember whether it was Serena or Venus), which, in effect, stated that Williams lost not because her opponent beat her but because she didn't play well that day. If we follow gfy's contention that it was purely UE's fault that they lost (the Archers had nothing at all to do with their poor play!!!), UE must be unbeatable whenever their players get up on the right side of the bed. C'mon, let's give credit where credit is due. "Ang sama ng laro namin" should be given equal weight as much as "ang ganda ng laro ng kalaban" when explaining a loss. After the team loses, everything sounds like an excuse.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-15-2006, 10:15 AM
People, please stop making additional discussions regarding the "DLSU mystique" thing. Anymore posts regarding that topic will be deleted from here on. Thanks.

gfy, ang choke di lang sa last minute nangyayari. Puede ka mag choke the whole game and tama ka, UE choked for the rest of the ballgame. Parang ayoko na ng routine ko, para malasin naman JRU hehehe.

gfy
12-15-2006, 10:32 AM
Nel - Don't I sometimes say "not to take away from your team's performance" or something of that sort? I don't remember UE being behind 0-18 in any game. It's just some people here are saying that kayang-kaya ninyo ang UE or any team for that matter because tinambakan ninyo sila and you'll always do that in the future. There are always reasons for a team's off-day and you shouldn't consider them as excuses. When you lost to our team B I didn't gloat or even make a comment because I knew that wasn't your real team. Now did I ever say na tatambakan kayo ng UE? No. I just said UE will win over you. I think what Mr. Pilo meant by "pag-panalo tambak" is that if UE wins it will be tambak because of the past games of UE where tinambakan nila ang mga kalaban nila. But he said "pag" which means that you could win.

Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.

dunkerslam
12-15-2006, 11:03 AM
Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.


In my opinion, there is a better chance for Osama Bin Laden to seek political asylum in Israel than for JRU or Ateneo to beat our present team. We're too dam good :D

bigfreeze_bibby
12-15-2006, 11:36 AM
Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.


In my opinion, there is a better chance for Osama Bin Laden to seek political asylum in Israel than for JRU or Ateneo to beat our present team.* We're too dam good* :D


Easy lang sa comments dude. All teams are strong, swerte lang and we get good breaks and outplay them that's why we are winning. Muntik na tayo matalo sa JRU if not for that crucial good performance in our last 5 minute stretch.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-15-2006, 11:42 AM
Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.


Di mo ata na-gets sinabi ko parekoy. What I am trying to say is that ang choke para sa kin is pag nawala ka sa diskarte mo during gametime maybe caused by the stellar play of the opposing team, or timaan ka ng kabog because of the pressure going inside your brain kaya nagiging tight ang laro ng isang team or player, which results to poor play of the team. Maaaring ito ang nangyari sa UE nung Wednesday kaya sila natalo sa amin. But I am not saying or implying that lahat ng teams takot pag kalaban La Salle. Malabong mangyari yan.

Kid Cubao
12-15-2006, 11:46 AM
tsk, tsk, excuses, excuses. paw na, hirit pa nang hirit hetong si gfy ;D

nel
12-15-2006, 12:00 PM
Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.


In my opinion, there is a better chance for Osama Bin Laden to seek political asylum in Israel than for JRU or Ateneo to beat our present team.* We're too dam good* :D


Let's not go overboard and delude ourselves that we can't lose to either of the two teams you mentioned. The worst thing we can do is to crow that our team as unbeatable, and then start believing in our own tall tales. Braggadocio has never been a La Sallian trait.

Ateneo was minus their 3 best players. After the NCAA, JRU has steadily shown a marked improvement, and they have a good coach. The other tough competitors like SBC have not really fielded their best teams or focused on this tournament. The Archers are hungrier for honest-to-goodness competition, and have shown that determination, which is probably absent from the other participants. JRU is a scrappy team which has the talent and determination to win after a long title drought.

The Archers are very raw at this point, and are definitely NOT in shape to win the UAAP if it were held today. The prior win against JRU is no assurance that we will win on Sunday; in fact JRU now has a better idea how we play, and we can expect their coaches to devise a game plan against us. Just hope that our players stick to the system.

BigBlue
12-15-2006, 12:07 PM
Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.


In my opinion, there is a better chance for Osama Bin Laden to seek political asylum in Israel than for JRU or Ateneo to beat our present team. We're too dam good :D


Easy lang sa comments dude. All teams are strong, swerte lang and we get good breaks and outplay them that's why we are winning. Muntik na tayo matalo sa JRU if not for that crucial good performance in our last 5 minute stretch.


didnt ateneo beat this team already? it may not have been in the HGC, and it wasnt our regular team, but ateneo already did beat the present DLSU team.

bigfreeze_bibby
12-15-2006, 01:37 PM
didnt ateneo beat this team already? it may not have been in the HGC, and it wasnt our regular team, but ateneo already did beat the present DLSU team.


Yup you are definitely correct pare. That's why the good showing that we have here in HGC is not the real basis of how good our team is or how good our team will perform next year. This was the best opportunity that we have right now of playing in front of national TV and playing against other good collegiate teams. Remember that there are 6 months room for other teams to adjust.

nel
12-15-2006, 02:40 PM
didnt ateneo beat this team already? it may not have been in the HGC, and it wasnt our regular team, but ateneo already did beat the present DLSU team.


Yup you are definitely correct pare. That's why the good showing that we have here in HGC is not the real basis of how good our team is or how good our team will perform next year. This was the best opportunity that we have right now of playing in front of national TV and playing against other good collegiate teams. Remember that there are 6 months room for other teams to adjust.


Agreed. On a good day, a "weaker" team can upend the favored team, and that's why sweeps are so rare in today's basketball tournaments. The Archers are having a good run in the Homegrown Cup, but that can easily end on Sunday. JRU is equally hungry for a title, and they've improved tremendously since the NCAA tournament ended. Looking forward to next season, all the teams are now starting their tryouts and preparations. The quality of coaching is pretty good, so expect all the other teams to have improved by the time the UAAP season opens.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-15-2006, 03:20 PM
Watched the DLSU segment on Hoop Nation last night. They were all saying they are still not in game shape but they will do 100 percent to get there. I have to agree with them. And I commend them for giving their all especially in the trying times. You'll never walk alone!

Fried Green Tomato
12-15-2006, 04:11 PM
gfy, wala ka talagang kadala-dala hahaha!

pero this much i can say: your posts are very entertaining not only to our hardcore la salle baller brothers but to every one who visits gameface.ph. we all need to be able to throw back our heads in laughter every now and then, and because of you, posts that leave you gagging for air will never be in short supply in these pages ;D


It came from you. ;D

We appreciate SENSIBLE comments, analysis & even suggestions coming from supporters of other schools. Some were even hard hitting comments but if there's some truth to it, even if we argue, we accept & respect the opinion.

Pero wala namang gaguhan. Wag naman sanang mag-analyzie just for the sake of posting something. Time & time again, we've been bombarded with ridiculous ideas and theories from gee... ooopppsss... gfy pala.

Okay lang na makulit kung bata ka pa o kahit nasa college ka pa lang... pero kung puti na ang buhok mo at mahirap ka pa rin makaintindi... baka 2nd childhood na yan?

Kaya nga tuwang tuwa kami sa apcom pag may post si gee... napapangiti kami at pampaalis suya!

glock23
12-15-2006, 04:20 PM
Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.


In my opinion, there is a better chance for Osama Bin Laden to seek political asylum in Israel than for JRU or Ateneo to beat our present team.* We're too dam good* :D


Easy lang sa comments dude. All teams are strong, swerte lang and we get good breaks and outplay them that's why we are winning. Muntik na tayo matalo sa JRU if not for that crucial good performance in our last 5 minute stretch.


didnt ateneo beat this team already? it may not have been in the HGC, and it wasnt our regular team, but ateneo already did beat the present DLSU team.



indeed, thats why i dont believe it when people are saying that ateneo will be a non-factor in next years UAAP. I still predict lasalle, ateneo, ust and ue to be in the final 4, in no particular order. Its still a long way to go before season 70 and a lot can still happen but those 4 teams will be the strongest.

gfy
12-15-2006, 04:21 PM
Bigfreeze - Napunta na tayo sa choke ni Kid. Ang choke for me is when a team who is considered also strong and doing ok until say the 4th quarter suddenly starts making unbelievable but usual errors against say a nemesis opponent. So may konting history na. This is just one interpretation and there are similar interpretations. UE never got off the ground so you can't say it choked. It just wasn't their day.

Nel and Brian - I didn't mean to belittle what your first 5 did in the first quarter. It's just the lead may not have been that big if UE played their first 5 albeit they may not have played together for quite a while. The UE team you beat wasn't just the same team that won the Champions League. In the same way the Green team we beat in FMC II wasn't the same team you have now.

FGT- As I have said, I may not be a technical expert but my general comments are the result of observing the teams - overall weaknesses and strengths, individual skills and so on. BTW, how come you stopped making those SENSIBLE kilometric narratives or whatever you call them against the blue thugs and the evil azure empire. I am starting to miss those. :D

Fried Green Tomato
12-15-2006, 04:38 PM
FGT- BTW, how come you stopped making those SENSIBLE kilometric narratives or whatever you call them against the blue thugs and the evil azure empire. I am starting to miss those.* :D

Simple... S U S P E N D E D kasi kami!

gfy
12-15-2006, 04:46 PM
Is that so? And since you started it you looked elegant with that long white shoulder bag but I wouldn't wear a matching white cap to hide that ... face.

Ranger
12-15-2006, 05:54 PM
Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.


In my opinion, there is a better chance for Osama Bin Laden to seek political asylum in Israel than for JRU or Ateneo to beat our present team. We're too dam good :D


Easy lang sa comments dude. All teams are strong, swerte lang and we get good breaks and outplay them that's why we are winning. Muntik na tayo matalo sa JRU if not for that crucial good performance in our last 5 minute stretch.


didnt ateneo beat this team already? it may not have been in the HGC, and it wasnt our regular team, but ateneo already did beat the present DLSU team.



ADMU beat DLSU in FMC sans two key players: Cholo Villanueva and Brian Ilad

brian
12-15-2006, 09:26 PM
Bigfreeze - Napunta na tayo sa choke ni Kid. Ang choke for me is when a team who is considered also strong and doing ok until say the 4th quarter suddenly starts making unbelievable but usual errors against say a nemesis opponent. So may konting history na. This is just one interpretation and there are similar interpretations. UE never got off the ground so you can't say it choked. It just wasn't their day.

Nel and Brian - I didn't mean to belittle what your first 5 did in the first quarter. It's just the lead may not have been that big if UE played their first 5 albeit they may not have played together for quite a while. The UE team you beat wasn't just the same team that won the Champions League. In the same way the Green team we beat in FMC II wasn't the same team you have now.

FGT- As I have said, I may not be a technical expert but my general comments are the result of observing the teams - overall weaknesses and strengths, individual skills and so on. BTW, how come you stopped making those SENSIBLE kilometric narratives or whatever you call them against the blue thugs and the evil azure empire. I am starting to miss those.* :D




ue is a strong team, we can't deny this, yes they played out of character ( maybe the other way around ;D), however, they still are the same team.....unlike us, losing a player to injuries or eligibilty will always be a factor re strategies but never shall affect the teams performance over all, yes, we may play badly or out of character in certain games but isn't because we are missing some players....we all have bad days and it does happen even with a full line-up, to each and every team that's ever played in this planet..

dindo's starting line up (your so called bench players) was there for a purpose, and it certainly isn't to lose...no coach would ever do this, purposely lose, in any league, more so the semi-finals..imagine if his second stringers hadn't failed miserably at the start of the game, by the time the starters are sent in, it would be for the kill..

parang naging match-up lang ang bench vs the starters...kasi by the time pasok na ang starters ng ue, it would have been playing our bench naman..boils down on who has the deeper bench or executed better eventually...kung hindi man nakapagpractice ang ue, then well rested sila kung ganon ha ha!

kaya nga may best of three series meaning there's always another game which doesn't guarantee the same result..there's always room for adjustments..yun nga lang, knockout game eto..

and just like nel, my glass is half-full so thanks but no thanks gfy..

and now re ateneo's team b victory over us, wag mong maliitin ang panalo niyo, we may have missed the services of some players, but the fact remains that team b niyo iyon ...we were touted to win that game...heck, varsity team namin yun..

what we should learn re la salle-ateneo rivalry, it isn't based on line-ups, coaching staff or whatever but on the intensity of it's rivalry which is the basic character of it's game after all...being the underdog motivated your team very well and we weren't ready for it...but lessons learned, how painful it may be.. we've made up for it already...

brian
12-15-2006, 09:40 PM
Bigfreeze - At the last minute or during crunch time is the same banana. It isn't like UE or any team is in awe of DLSU that it will always lose when it faces DLSU.


In my opinion, there is a better chance for Osama Bin Laden to seek political asylum in Israel than for JRU or Ateneo to beat our present team.* We're too dam good* :D



Easy lang sa comments dude. All teams are strong, swerte lang and we get good breaks and outplay them that's why we are winning. Muntik na tayo matalo sa JRU if not for that crucial good performance in our last 5 minute stretch.


didnt ateneo beat this team already? it may not have been in the HGC, and it wasnt our regular team, but ateneo already did beat the present DLSU team.



yup ateneo very well did.. pero according to gfy, it was a different team ha ha.. .paano niya kaya naiisip ang mga gani-ganitong bagay ha ha!..

brian
12-15-2006, 09:43 PM
tsk, tsk, excuses, excuses. paw na, hirit pa nang hirit hetong si gfy ;D


kid,

dapat siguro dit kay gfy eh ay mag "beep beep beep beep" muna,.. tabi kayo baka kayo maipit he he!

brian
12-15-2006, 09:59 PM
No SBC mystique because in the last 10 years before this year, SBC was never in the radar screen. SBC was nowhere in the level of DLSU. We would have tune up games with SBC during summers ... do you really want to know by how much we used to massacre you guys? Just ask your past coaches...Rene Baena, Jonathan Reyes, Nash Racela...
*

I think the issue caused by lekiboy's post was already settled, until you you revived it.

You are right with regard to "used to" as the operative word* in describing the outcome of those tune up games.* *However, the 1978 finals should be the better gauge* because that event was more significant than the tune up games you mentioned.

Since this is your forum and Christmas is just around the corner,* I will let you have the last word. :)

Merry Christmas!*






busina muna OT..

lion,

could you extend our deepest condolences to sbc assistant coach leo pujante, his dad passed away the other night thanks..

and so to our very own tonichi pujante former greenies' coach..

thanks bfb ;)

flsfnoeraekadad
12-15-2006, 11:06 PM
Nanalo na nga kayo gee sa team a namin na gamit ang team b nyo may excuses ka pa din? Ibang klase hehehe. :D

gfy
12-16-2006, 01:17 AM
Brian - I've never seen a coach play his second unit to start a semi-final game. Not for the reasons you mentioned. And yes Ateneo Team B won and they worked hard for it and I was cheering for them but I'm a realist enough to say we caught you on an off-day and without Cholo and Ilad. You played well and won over UE. But don't you think that your victory would have been sweeter if the UE team that prepared hard for the Champions League showed up in that game?

Flsfnoeraekadad - What excuses are you talking about?

Kid Cubao - I have no quarrel with you. There are already enough Greenies more than I can handle that I don't need another Atenean to join the fray.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-16-2006, 01:40 AM
Flsfnoeraekadad - What excuses are you talking about?
Wala po manong gee. Baka ma-misunderstood mo ako eh. Haha.

nel
12-16-2006, 08:51 AM
Brian - I've never seen a coach play his second unit to start a semi-final game. Not for the reasons you mentioned.


Many coaches want some of their quality players to come off the bench instead being starters, the reason being that if they have a significant quality drop between the first and second units, they could easily fall behind when they rest the starters. That's why you'll see teams with one or two starter-quality players (who would be on the first 5 of other teams) stay on the bench when the game starts. These players are the first off the bench, and if I'm not mistaken, were called the "6th man" (not the Ateneo version) in the NBA. I know that there used to be an award for the "super sub" in the NBA.

Coach Dindo probably took this to the extreme, by reserving his best 5 for the time when the Archers would start resting some of its key players midway in the opening quarter. If the Warriors "shock troopers" could keep it close, their first five could then step on the gas when they came in while the Archers would not play as effectively with the subs. Dindo may also have wanted to have his best five retain a high energy level to close the first quarter, and maybe keep them fresh for the end game and conserve their fouls.

It was a gamble, no doubt, and it could have worked if the UE subs had been able to keep the Archers within striking distance. As it transpired, the Archers jumped all over the UE starters en route to that 18-point lead, and that was the game. UE had to expend a lot of energy to try to catch up, and probably could not go to "Plan B" because of the sizeable deficit they had throughout the game.

Ranger
12-16-2006, 10:37 AM
Brian - I've never seen a coach play his second unit to start a semi-final game. Not for the reasons you mentioned. And yes Ateneo Team B won and they worked hard for it and I was cheering for them but I'm a realist enough to say we caught you on an off-day and without Cholo and Ilad. You played well and won over UE. But don't you think that your victory would have been sweeter if the UE team that prepared hard for the Champions League showed up in that game?

Flsfnoeraekadad - What excuses are you talking about?

Kid Cubao - I have no quarrel with you. There are already enough Greenies more than I can handle that I don't need another Atenean to join the fray.



The UE team showed up with a complete roster that day. their first team got the game close in the second quarter but was still left behind in the third quarter. Bear in mind that DLSU also didn't start the game with its regular first five. Instead of Cholo and Walsham, Malabes and Batricevic started the game. The guys eventually nailed three pointers to start the game and set the tone.

brian
12-16-2006, 11:20 AM
Brian - I've never seen a coach play his second unit to start a semi-final game. Not for the reasons you mentioned. And yes Ateneo Team B won and they worked hard for it and I was cheering for them but I'm a realist enough to say we* caught you on an off-day and without Cholo and Ilad. You played well and won over UE. But don't you think that your victory would have been sweeter if the UE team that prepared hard for the Champions League showed up in that game?

Flsfnoeraekadad - What excuses are you talking about?

Kid Cubao - I have no quarrel with you. There are already enough Greenies more than I can handle that I don't need another Atenean to join the fray.



well, for a so called realist, you should start to be more realistic ha ha! you dwell too much on what if it were this or that...the truth of the matter is that ue lost....it can't be much more real than this!

even if they started with their usual line-up, we were having a good day, our shots were going in and we were executing well..and this is a factor for any team in any basketball game (ir of other sports for this matter) to win against a team with a full line-up or not..and to compound ue's woes, they weren't just ready for this...

the ue-la salle game (dlsu win) wasn't even much less an upset compared compared to the ateneo fmc2 win. sa fmc we were really expected to win but it didn't happen ...

it's how you play and not whom you play in order to eventually win a gAME...this will always be part and parcel of dlsu basketball.

believe it.................or not!!! ha ha!

david64
12-16-2006, 12:25 PM
This Sunday JRU and DLSU play a 1-game championship. It can go either way; whoever blinks loses; any team can beat another (including one that MAY be slightly superior) at any given time, so this 1 game championship can go either way. As I said in ap.com, the format of the HGC leaves much to be desired, but the organizers were stuck with the time frame,etc. They just could not hold a very long semi/final series. Even the teams have played too much basketball.

JRU will enter this game with a lot of confidence. We've played only twice this year, one a practice game in Reyes, another, the HGC 2 weeks ago. Neither game will determine how Sunday's game will go, as JRU will be very keen on getting this win. I just hope DLSU starts well, and that we do not have any injuries by Sunday. As of now, everyone (Walsham, Ilad and Cholo) will be suiting up for the Green Archers.

Sayang. I won't be there to watch the game, but i'll be keeping track of how it goes.

gfy
12-16-2006, 12:25 PM
I know the UE line-up was complete. But as I mentioned earlier, their first 5 (except for Martinez) didn't really have enough practice time together because of PBL commitments (Borboran, Gregorio, Canizares, Espiritu and Arellano). It's probably the reason why Dindo started with their second unit. It worked before with the other teams but DLSU is entirely a different banana. Now that second unit is not really at par with DLSU's first 5 even with Batrievic and Malabes. If I am not mistaken, they had Fampulme, Acuna, Martinez, another rookie guard and Thiele. Although Dindo put together the first 5 at the start of the 2nd half, for most of the game he had some of the veterans with the second unit. Again, the PBL guys were not practicing with the team so the chemistry was not there. And finally Dindo gave up and experimented with a lot of combinations to see if they will work. This was made more difficult because of the pressing defense by the Archers and the pressure to overcome the lead.

Nel - I was thinking of local basketball. For an important semi-final game, I've never seen it in the NCAA and UAAP. Most of the teams here have at most 7 good players on their team unlike perhaps in the NBA where the second unit may be as good as the starting 5.

brian
12-16-2006, 12:59 PM
I know the UE line-up was complete. But as I mentioned earlier, their first 5 (except for Martinez) didn't really have enough practice time together because of PBL commitments (Borboran, Gregorio, Canizares, Espiritu and Arellano). It's probably the reason why Dindo started with their second unit. It worked before with the other teams but DLSU is entirely a different banana. Now that second unit is not really at par with DLSU's first 5 even with Batrievic and Malabes. If I am not mistaken, they had Fampulme, Acuna, Martinez, another rookie guard and Thiele. Although Dindo put together the first 5 at the start of the 2nd half, for most of the game he had some of the veterans with the second unit. Again, the PBL guys were not practicing with the team so the chemistry was not there. And finally Dindo gave up and experimented with a lot of combinations to see if they will work. This was made more difficult because of the pressing defense by the Archers and the pressure to overcome the lead.

Nel - I was thinking of local basketball. For an important semi-final game, I've never seen it in the NCAA and UAAP. Most of the teams here have at most 7 good players on their team unlike perhaps in the NBA where the second unit may be as good as the starting 5.



so bale kung natalo kami, we could very well say na kasi kagagaling lang sa injury si marko...but since we did win, it doesn't really matter ha ha!...

and before long, in tnhe basketball world according to gee, what the players had for dinner would be a main factor in any game...hindi maganda laro kasi halfcooked lang yun vegetables na kinain nila eh he he!.

glock23
12-16-2006, 02:41 PM
I know the UE line-up was complete. But as I mentioned earlier, their first 5 (except for Martinez) didn't really have enough practice time together because of PBL commitments (Borboran, Gregorio, Canizares, Espiritu and Arellano). It's probably the reason why Dindo started with their second unit. It worked before with the other teams but DLSU is entirely a different banana. Now that second unit is not really at par with DLSU's first 5 even with Batrievic and Malabes. If I am not mistaken, they had Fampulme, Acuna, Martinez, another rookie guard and Thiele. Although Dindo put together the first 5 at the start of the 2nd half, for most of the game he had some of the veterans with the second unit. Again, the PBL guys were not practicing with the team so the chemistry was not there. And finally Dindo gave up and experimented with a lot of combinations to see if they will work. This was made more difficult because of the pressing defense by the Archers and the pressure to overcome the lead.

Nel - I was thinking of local basketball. For an important semi-final game, I've never seen it in the NCAA and UAAP. Most of the teams here have at most 7 good players on their team unlike perhaps in the NBA where the second unit may be as good as the starting 5.



Gfy, alam mo naman pala that the UE starting 5 didint have enough practice time because of PBL commitment, and that the chemistry was not there? Yet you picked ue to win over us? You are contadicting yourself!

Piece of advice, just save your analysis for the ateneo and dont mind us. We can take care of ourselves. Ang hilig nyong nakikialam sa ibang team. pati FEU pinasok nyo na kaya nagkawatak watak. but thats OT already.

gfy
12-17-2006, 12:22 AM
Glock23 - I learned only later from Mr. Espiritu that their 5 veterans didn't regularly practice with the team.

Brian - Have it your way. When you have 5 of your best players - not one or two - not regularly practicing with your team, it will have an effect on the team. If your 5 veterans did not regularly practice with the rest of the Archers, don't you think it will not have an effect on your team no matter how good they are individually? Well enough of this UE-DLSU analysis. I am sure your team and JRU have prepared hard for the championship game and may the best team win.

brian
12-17-2006, 01:29 AM
Glock23 - I learned only later from Mr. Espiritu that their 5 veterans didn't regularly practice with the team.

Brian - Have it your way. When you have 5 of your best players - not one or two - not regularly practicing with your team, it will have an effect on the team. If your 5 veterans did not regularly practice with the rest of the Archers, don't you think it will not have an effect on your team no matter how good they are individually? Well enough of this UE-DLSU analysis. I am sure your team and JRU have prepared hard for the championship game and may the best team win.


palusot lang yan no practice....even in the uaap's semi-finals match last season, ue was beaten by ust despite a full line-up ( chemistry intact, they were the no 2 team, but of course they were without custodio in the second game however, they deemed him detrimental tho their cause ).. and you wouldn't have expected ust to repeat, guess what? they did...onwards to the finals against ateneo whom they eventually beat twice in a row too....

this is the nature of the game, if we'd base every match on stats and and individual athleticsm ( on this basis alone, team usa should have handily won the recent world championship)...what's the use of playing then? that is why we have intangibles..we should also base the match on the character of the respecitve teams..this is why it is also important that we build character to compliment talent.

in the PBA, alska is a very strong team on paper and could very well beat any team, any given day, despite the injury of mike cortez, but the opposite has happened...every team is also to prone to having a bad season..their early losses may have been a factor i guess..

but your predictions have been based on such team merits wherein a game is already won without being played which makes your analysis the more defective..

you'd just have to admit that you were wrong, plain and simple...ue without their starters had beaten dlsu in the past, due to this, we perhaps have learned how to play them straight up. it's not as if first time namin against ue, we may have scouted their bench pretty well since we've learned the hard way that we could be beaten at any given day as evidenced by ateneo's team b victory over us..don't you think that ue's coaching staff has not scouted us in one way or another too? and due to this, they may have derived a game plan which just didn't work..

and you,( pardon me for i humble myself he he), with your inimitable great wisdom, infinite as you'd like it to sound, well,* just doesnt work with us too..but still you don't get it ha ha!

gfy
12-17-2006, 03:05 AM
I finally got the time to watch the DLSU-UE game which I recorded. The 18-0 run (when UE's second unit was on the floor) was mainly due to several fastbreaks and excellent jumpers/incursions by Casio and T@ng. When Dindo brought in Borboran, Espiritu and Gregorio (or a combination with Canizares, Thiele and Fampulme) from the 6th minute of the 1Q to the end of the first half (where at one time the lead was down to 6) there were practically no incursions into the paint by Casio, T@ng, Malabes and Barua. Casio slipped on a drive to the basket. Barua missed on a short jumper. Cua committed a charge and T@ng's fastbreak was stopped by Bandaying and Espiritu (Bandaying committed an unsportmanlike on T@ng after the drive).* T@ng had 2 jumpers from 18 ft.

In the second half, UE started with their first 5. Again no incursions from the above people except for a shot or 2 by Cua. There was a long pass to Barua who was all alone and scored. And a way ahead fastbreak by Casio. Don't remember if these were off turnovers. I think even Cholo didn't have much success against UE's frontline. There were 2 or 3 timely jumpers from Kish Co but these were from 16 ft. It was Maierhofer and Ilad who were scoring inside the paint. The lead ranged from 10-20 more or less during this time up to the 5th minute of the 4Q. At this time, Dindo practically gave up by fielding again his second unit. Casio et al again did what they did in that 18-0 run in the 1Q. This was garbage time.

So why did UE lose? First the 18-0 run. Second, their shots from usually reliable scorers were not falling in. Third, there were a lot of miscues/turnovers inside the paint. Passing errors as well. Fourth, Ilad and Maierhofer played very well particularly in the 3rd Q to maintain that 18-0 cushion established at the start of the game.

Re issue of starting the second unit, I think this is also feasible in the PBA and even in the PBL where the roster is laden with talent.

brian
12-17-2006, 10:00 AM
So why did UE lose? First the 18-0 run. Second, their shots from usually reliable scorers were not falling in. Third, there were a lot of miscues/turnovers inside the paint. Passing errors as well. Fourth, Ilad and Maierhofer played very well particularly in the 3rd Q to maintain that 18-0 cushion established at the start of the game.

Re issue of starting the second unit, I think this is also feasible in the PBA and even in the PBL where the roster is laden with talent.





why then were their shots not falling in? baka nababantayan (or hurried shots?)......why were there miscues/turnovers inside the paint and passing errors? i guess defense had got nothing to do with it either.....you really make it seem like ue wasa just playing by themselves..

rico m and brian playing well to maintain the 18pt lead you say, are you just referring to theiir offense?

david64
12-17-2006, 10:07 AM
On the 18-0 run, you forget that Marko and Bader(2) made 3 pt. baskets too. And those breaks by Casio and Barua-off turnovers from the press.

On the 5 that Dindo fielded to start the ballgame, I don't think there was anything wrong with them-they are good players and can (and have in the past) held their own against the best in college ball. If UE had gone ahead 18-0, we probably would be pointing AT THE WRONG DLSU starting five! Could the 5 of DLSU have had a little to do about that 18-0 run? Dindo did call a timeout at the 8-0 mark, unfortunately, La Salle went on a 10-0 tear after that. Could Dindo have done something else? Maybe, but it's hard to do a 'what could have' or 'what should have'.. at this point. Did the UE coaching staff make a scouting mistake? Again, maybe.

Funny, but we have to admit that La Salle had something to do not just with the 18-0 start, but also with the win. Maybe DLSU, its players and coaches had something to do with the win, more than UE had with losing?

As i've said in previous posts, any team can beat any other team on any given night/day. UE started very poorly; DLSU started very well. That's the way the ball bounced that day.

gfy
12-17-2006, 12:32 PM
The turnovers forced or unforced could have been as a result of your pressure defense or lack of preparation by UE or both. Actually I didn't see much pressure defense by you in the second and 3rd quarter. The long shots by Marko and Malabes in the early going again could also be due to poor defense by the second unit (the guys were really slow and several of those shots were wide-open shots). Arellano plays tight defense and could have limited the output of either T@ng or Casio. Correct me if I am wrong but I didn't see many long shots by your gunners in the 2Q and in 3Q. We will just have to disagree about the competence of their second unit. For the next UAAP season, UE and other teams should prepare to defend against Maierhofer and Ilad. The other teams have good, tall guards who will defend well vs.T@ng, Casio and even Malabes. It is very difficult to defend vs. the tall shooters of UE like Borboran, Canizares and Gregorio. Maybe just Maierhofer. Their shots were not just falling in. I may agree with you that Martinez was guarded well but Arellano? I am not taking anything from your win. I just think that UE made a few strategic mistakes and they were just off that day.

nel
12-17-2006, 01:22 PM
gfy,

Many of us wonder why (at least from where we sit) you seem to attribute the La Salle-UE result to a number of reasons that seem to have all to do with UE and very little to do with La Salle. For example, the starting unit, UE's not playing well, missing their shots, best players not having practiced together, etc.

I may be wrong in my impression, but you don't seem to really give credit to the Archers (coaches and players). We've seen the various reasons (excuses?) for UE's losing, but it's entirely possible that that horrible start by UE was also caused (at least in part) by the Archers' game plan which was executed well. We do admit that UE is a very good team, but on that day they were totally outplayed (I don't think that is an exaggeration) by the Archers. That loss on that particular day was, in my opinion, more due to the way the Archers played that caused a bad game by UE. For me, it was the preparation, strategy, and game-time execution of the Archers more than UE's having a bad day that determined the outcome. Look at the track record of UE vs La Salle for the last few years, and you'll see that despite UE's always having a team with strong individual talents, they've lost most of the games against us. That's not a fluke, it's probably the way the coaches prep the team for each opponent.

gfy
12-17-2006, 03:52 PM
How come a pundit like me did not see that UE wasn't taking this Homegrown Cup seriously? The signs were everywhere...

brian
12-17-2006, 05:15 PM
How come a pundit like me did not see that UE wasn't taking this Homegrown Cup seriously? The signs were everywhere...


huh? so this is where it's come to now....ha ha!, straight from the horse's mouth...no respect for the game!!!

congrats archers!!! animo la salle!!!

nel
12-17-2006, 06:23 PM
La Salle had the advantage of not having any players in the PBL, so they were totally focused, determined, and wanted to prove a point.

We've always felt that the other strong teams may not have really been going all out - SBC never played with its complete championship roster, and UST had to juggle its schedules between the PBL and the Homegrown cup. Ateneo didn't play Intal, Escalona, and Kramer. UE, well, they came with a complete lineup. JRU definitely was serious about their team. They'll be one of the teams to watch next year in the NCAA.

flsfnoeraekadad
12-17-2006, 07:25 PM
GFY tama na PLEASE!!! Maawa ka naman sa amin kung daggers lang ang comments mo malamang marami ka na nang napatay na Lasalista sa bland and yuckily bad and stpuid comments mo. The Archers never seem to impress you and we understand that cause you're coming from the blue side. But please, PLEASE LANG, stop butting in at tama na ang pagmamarunong. Let us, Lasallians, handle the business of commenting on the Archers' game and do your job on the Eagles.

brian
12-17-2006, 07:50 PM
La Salle had the advantage of not having any players in the PBL, so they were totally focused, determined, and wanted to prove a point.

We've always felt that the other strong teams may not have really been going all out - SBC never played with its complete championship roster, and UST had to juggle its schedules between the PBL and the Homegrown cup. Ateneo didn't play Intal, Escalona, and Kramer. UE, well, they came with a complete lineup. JRU definitely was serious about their team. They'll be one of the teams to watch next year in the NCAA.


nel,

any which way you look at, complete roster or not, no recent practices and whatever gee could think of, it shouldn't take away the determination of any team to win....

let's just put it this way for the benefit of gee, perhaps we may say that the homegrown cupo isn't the immediate priority of each and every team which joined the tournament, however, once you're in it, the main goal is to win as much games as you can...i don't think it's fair to denigrate any team's character professing that they just aren't serious about the game..

on the other hand, a team with a weaker roster should be more determined or driven in order to overcome their much stronger opponents,(doesn't mean that if you don't have a complete roster nor recent practices, you won't go all the way out)* there's just no other way ..however, dlsu proved to be just too much in the homegrown cup..

and let's not forget, we too are coming from a long lay-off..

gfy has been assuming too much in order to prove his point...i don't think nang aasar lang yan (medyo kulang kulang lang he he)

and again if i may add, we have just lost in the recent fmc2 tournament, we did have a strong and competetive roster then, pretty much the same we have now, but no one from us claimed that we didn't take the tournament seriously, of course we were there to win it all, well, we didn't..

Wingman
12-17-2006, 11:00 PM
Pabayaan niyo na si gee. Ganyan talaga mag-analyze ang mga atenista. Baluktot.

Now gee, let me ask you, why did JRU lost? Kasi malas ang players nila? Kasi hindi nakapag-practice?

brian
12-17-2006, 11:03 PM
GFY tama na PLEASE!!! Maawa ka naman sa amin kung daggers lang ang comments mo malamang marami ka na nang napatay na Lasalista sa bland and yuckily bad and stpuid comments mo. The Archers never seem to impress you and we understand that cause you're coming from the blue side. But please, PLEASE LANG, stop butting in at tama na ang pagmamarunong. Let us, Lasallians, handle the business of commenting on the Archers' game and do your job on the Eagles.


dapat nga sa ue subforum siya mag comment about the game ha ha! ang laro lang naman ng ue ang ina anlyze niya eh..

nel
12-17-2006, 11:25 PM
bri,

I agree. If we had lost, I don't think we would have brought out a long line of reasons (aka excuses) of why we lost. Simple, our opponents had more points at the end of the game than we did. You won't hear any excuses from most of us. We give credit where credit is due.

I'm getting tired of trying to get gfy to see that our team did have a great influence on the outcome of all the games we had. Our opponents didn't come to the Philsports to roll over and play dead. But there are all sorts of reasons being brought out on why our opponents lost, and very few on why we won. Even kid cubao had a couple of comments on how gfy viewed our games.

Anyway, that's all she wrote for the Homegrown Cup. Let's see, JRU had an off day, and their key players went into foul trouble, the ball wouldn't stay in their goal, they didn't get enough sleep last night dancing Boom Tarat Tarat, etc. Any more creative excuses?