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Howard the Duck
07-13-2006, 09:30 PM
What punishment would you do, assuming La Salle is really guilty?

Ako ganito na lang, let them play the whole elimination round, but they're disqualified in the playoffs sa men's basketball. Sa ibang sports na kasali ang La Salle, no changes.

brian
07-14-2006, 12:49 AM
well, assuming la salle is really guilty of complicity, we ought to be banned for a year..

now, since (assumig also this is the correct call) negligence ang verdict, siguro para sa akin ganito nalang, disqualified ang la salle sa first round games...give the other teams one win each, then sa second round nalang sila kasali...la salle would have a very slim chance, if not any, to enter the play-offs..

useless naman kung palaruin pa ang la salle then be disqualified sa play-offs..para que pa maglalaro?

eto ay kung ako lang naman ang tatanungin...

bigfreeze_bibby
07-14-2006, 07:47 AM
Since negligence ang kaso and hindi naman complicity, forfeiture of La Salle's games from 2003 up to 2005 should have been the penalty. Kumbaga, 0-14 kami for 3 seasons. Regular playing rules will still apply for this season. But if it is complicity, then La Salle should be suspended for 1 year across all sports.

oca
07-14-2006, 08:56 AM
1. Dahil negligence lang naman ang findings, make an exception from that rule making basketball (with volleyball) as mandatory sport and suspend the DLSU basketball team ONLY for 1 season. Then upon reinstatement, put the basketball team under probation for at least a year, disqualifying the basketball team from point contribution to the UAAP overall race.

2. Forward a copy of the report ( meron nga ba?) to the NBI. Since PEP Cert is a public document, kung may nameke, dapat may makasuhan. As it is, kung wala sino man from DLSU ang maghahabol kina Salgado at Lacson (ang binanggit na may kinalaman o pakana raw), ganoon na lang ba? Magkakalimutan na lang...

brian
07-14-2006, 11:27 AM
2. Forward a copy of the report ( meron nga ba?) to the NBI. Since PEP Cert is a public document, kung may nameke, dapat may makasuhan. As it is, kung wala sino man from DLSU ang maghahabol kina Salgado at Lacson (ang binanggit na may kinalaman o pakana raw), ganoon na lang ba? Magkakalimutan na lang...
yun nga ang punto kay salgado at lacson, kaso, wala nang maidudlot pang maganda para sa la salle kung i-pursue pa nila yun para sakin, tanggal na sila, suspended na kami at pinagbabayaran na namin ang nangyari maski wala kaming kasalanan..(of course arguable sa iba eto)..

maski naman sa lahat ng criminal cases gaya ng holdap o pang iisnatch, karapatan ng biktima ang hindi maghabla..

for instance, a family member of mine had stolen my car, and i had it reported, upon getting caught by the police, i then decide not to press charges, is there something wrong with that..

however, it is also the perogative of the police to press their own charges for it in fact is a crime....

now, if other people feel that this would make them happy, then they could file the charges themselves, there's nothing wrong with that too..

ika nga, these people had given us their unwaivering support and loyalty all their life (naging misguided nga lang).. and we, in my opinion, should give them the consideration they at least deserve...now, if someone else should file the proper charges, then it's out of our hands already...so be it..

sana ay maintindihan mo ang kalagayan namin...salamat!

gfy
07-14-2006, 05:08 PM
Brian - falsification of a public document is a public crime, not a private one. The integrity of the school is at stake here to erase all doubt of, for example, a cover-up.

gfy
07-14-2006, 05:33 PM
In many countries (not in the Philippines) the government itself will investigate and prosecute even without a complaint. Referring the matter to the authorities will at least force them to take action.

brian
07-14-2006, 05:54 PM
In many countries (not in the Philippines) the government itself will investigate and prosecute even without a complaint. Referring the matter to the authorities will at least force them to take action.


ha ha! eto ka na naman....then go on ahead, if you very well feel that you're a victim (kung feeling mo naapi ka)....and by the way, why isn't our government doing anything about this too....sulatan mo kaya, wag kami ang kulitin mo..

as i have stated in my analogy, it isn't illegal if we don't pursue the case, our reputation is intact any other way, and there is also nothing wrong if you pursue it yourself..c'mon, act on your so called principles yourself, if you so insist...

brian
07-14-2006, 05:58 PM
Brian - falsification of a public document is a public crime, not a private one. The integrity of the school is at stake here to erase all doubt of, for example, a cover-up.


i agree, then call the cops.....cover-up? we wouldn 't have implicated them if we were covering up, would we?

in the first place, who were the ones very much affected by their misdeeds? di ba kami, so we therefore reserve the right (mahirap ba maintindihan yun?)...

sige esep pa gfy esep!!!...we have suffered enough, that's the point, however, whatever you may do for your own satisfaction isn't any concern of us...whatever makes you happy, go for it!!!

gfy
07-14-2006, 08:17 PM
La Salle having suffered enough is beside the point. If you say that DLSU's reputation is intact, so be it.

gfy
07-14-2006, 09:05 PM
What for example if the authorities, after investigation, determine that Benetiz and Gatchalian were solely responsible for the falsification? That would be good for DLSU wouldn't it? And that would erase all doubt, wouldn't it?

Howard the Duck
07-14-2006, 09:26 PM
Boys, stick to the topic.

But since I can't keep my mouth shut:
It is La Salle's decision if they'll want to file charges. The government will not act unless may reklamong isinampa sa kanya. Kung ayaw ng La Salle magsampa ng kaso, nasa kanila na iyon.

Now back to regular programming:
Okay din yung suspended sa first round. Pero sa akin naman, for example kasali ka sa buong tourney tapos disqualified ka for the playoffs, then you make the people "suffer" like finishing in the top 2 para 2x to beat, yun lang nga di ka pa rin kasali. Alam ko ang NCAA USA ganito ginagawa, kung may ginawang kolokohan, banned sila sa March Madness.

brian
07-14-2006, 10:38 PM
maraming salamat howard..back to the topic.

maaari rin yan suggestion mo, parang pinagparticipate nalang ang la salle...kaya lang, di naman gaano kadami ng teams sa uaap di gaya ng us ncaa, unless hindi counted sa win-loss record ang games ng la salle, magiging spoiler na lang ang la salle lalo na sa standings. unfair naman siguro kung may bearing sa ibang teams ang game pero sa la salle bale walana since di rin naman makakapasok sa final four..

kay para sa akin, it's either you let us participate with underlying conditions or not at all.

pero sa ibang sports...agree ako to let them participate with no changes...

brian
07-14-2006, 11:16 PM
What for example if the authorities, after investigation, determine that Benetiz and Gatchalian were solely responsible for the falsification? That would be good for DLSU wouldn't it? And that would erase all doubt, wouldn't it?


sorry, di ko matiis eh..

gfy,

what good will it do us to throw the people whom, all their years, had dedicated themsleves (even at their lowest moment) to the service of la salle even to a fault, ika nga, in jail?, ......may konting consideration naman kami, and we are allowed it since it was us hurt the most..and to top that, yes, we still remain suspended..

what doubt? there is no doubt that we allowed this incident to happen. heck, we admitted it in the first place. have we denied anything? and so far, we are already paying heavily for it...so pray tell, what doubt would we erase?

then again, you mention that an investigation may even be good for la salle. since when has the good of la salle concerned "you"? yeah, when hell freezes over, it will...

now gfy, try to contribute something worth discussing on this thread such as, "if you were the uaap board", what would you have done? ( since marami ka naman gustong ipagawa sa amin eh ha ha!) bigyan mo muna ng break ang utak mo sa kaiisip sa la salle..

and if by chance you would like to discuss the matter furthermore, you could request bigfreeze_bibby to reopen the thread that properly corresponds with this topic..

back to the topic na....

gfy
07-15-2006, 01:19 AM
I would have suspended just your men's basketball team for a year. Brian, bakit ko naman palaging iisipin ang La Salle? I just respond to the neverending tales you guys concoct at your site. The doubt is that a lot more people may be involved. Para ba yung nangyari sa Palarong Pambansa. Yun pang mga matatanda ang gumawa ng katarantaduhan by faking the birth certificates of the baseball players. AND the government is investigating it na daw.

bigfreeze_bibby
07-15-2006, 09:10 AM
Howard, you are correct in saying that pag may isang team na may nagawang kalokohan sa US NCAA, they are not allowed to join the March Madness.

To gfy, your point is the same as with the other thread regarding what happened to Salgado and Lacson. Sabi ko nga doon, if all of you guys are so concerned with this issue, go ahead and tell Bro. Armin and Dra. Quebengco regarding your points of action and your views regarding the matter. Baka sakaling sundin pa nila ang ideas ninyo dito.

Regarding the Palarong Pambansa issue, it should really have been investigated by the government because national team competitions ang pinaguusapan dito unlike UAAP which is a private institution.

atenean_blooded
07-15-2006, 10:27 AM
Just suspension for a year may be insufficient if that were the case. Thus, the following, compound punishment.

1. Suspension from all sporting events for one year per ineligible player in addition to one year suspension from all sporting events for one year per year an individual ineligible player played. (In the case of Benitez, that's 1 year for Benitez, plus one year for every year he played. Assume 2003-2005, so that's 3 years. Plus the 1 year = 4 years).

2. La Salle being placed under strict probation upon return from suspension for the same duration as the total number of years spent suspended.

3. UAAP oversight over La Salle's recruitment processes, with the ability to demand explanations from La Salle at any point in time, given any reasonable doubt or suspicion as manifested in a formal query by any member university of the UAAP.

While the punishment is being served out, the UAAP board will also help La Salle in developing and pursuing a case against the perpetrators of the PEP Test Scandal (Lacson and Salgado), in order to get to the bottom of the scandal in the courts.

Noncompliance with any of the terms will merit automatic termination of membership from the UAAP, which shall be forwarded to the different basketball associations in the Philippines.

gfy
07-16-2006, 12:32 AM
Blooded - Masyado ka naman mahigpit

Bigfreeze - Faking of a public document is a violation of the law whether in the Palaro or in the UAAP. And I am not crazy about what DLSU does or should do. Law enforcement is a joke in this country anyway. Malayo pa tayo sa kultura sa America. Doon, kung tanungin mo ang isang police officer what he does he oftentimes would reply I am in law enforcement.

atenean_blooded
07-16-2006, 12:45 AM
Blooded - Masyado ka naman mahigpit

Bigfreeze - Faking of a public document is a violation of the law whether in the Palaro or in the UAAP. And I am not crazy about what DLSU does or should do. Law enforcement is a joke in this country anyway. Malayo pa tayo sa kultura sa America. Doon, kung tanungin mo ang isang police officer what he does he oftentimes would reply I am in law enforcement.


The scenario given was La Salle really being guilty. This implies complicity, which has gone on for years, at the expense of seven other member schools of the UAAP. This is the basis of the being "mahigpit."

What circumstances we have clear to us, however, was La Salle's being negligent. And as I've said it many times in the past, the punishment given is a proper one.

bigfreeze_bibby
07-16-2006, 03:04 PM
3. UAAP oversight over La Salle's recruitment processes, with the ability to demand explanations from La Salle at any point in time, given any reasonable doubt or suspicion as manifested in a formal query by any member university of the UAAP.


Tingin ko dapat gawin na ito ng UAAP. Not just for La Salle, but for all 8 member schools as well for preventive action na maulit pa itong mga pangyayaring ganito.

EngWalker
07-16-2006, 05:08 PM
Probation should be enough. Suspension is an overkill.

gfy, the salgado-lacson issue has been discussed in another thread which is already given a last word by bigfreeze and is already closed. why, pray tell, would you want to raise it here again if you really aren't interested in it?

Obvious ka na, sister.

gfy
07-16-2006, 10:03 PM
^^ Probation? And what is your basis? Oh yes, I forgot. You consider all the 7 directors of the Board who voted to suspend you as biased, incompetent fools. In my opinion, the Board should amend that mandatory rule to allow suspension only in basketball - juniors, seniors or women's.

I brought the Salgado-Lacson matter up again because Oca mentioned forwarding the case or report to the NBI. Me and Brian were having a DECENT argument, pro and con, when the thread starter advised us to get back to the topic.

brian
07-16-2006, 10:31 PM
i agee with engwalker...probation would have been enough,... the basis being the uaap had no basis at all he he! well, until of course they send us a clarification in reply to our request....

dapat siguro, ciguro they chould have been thorough enough to investigate matters and act on the facts they have all gathered...they should have recommended a course of action, which in turn, the board would vote upon..

there was no recommendation whatsoever, and still the board voted on the suspension, parang from the onset, dun din ang bagsak ng prusisyon, nagpaligoy-ligoy pa...

kung ako ang board, i would have let la salle play this season with conditions pertaining to the uaap rules and regulations such as forfeiting the last two season's games...

then when they have gathered all the facts (including kay salgado and lacson) then should act upon this even in the middle of the season..

all they have had so far are speculations masquerading as facts, walang clearcut na bidensya, kaya nga siguro negligence ang verdict....but then again, they do whate ever they want, don't they, kaya 1 year suspension ang nakuha namin...

atenean_blooded
07-16-2006, 11:02 PM
3. UAAP oversight over La Salle's recruitment processes, with the ability to demand explanations from La Salle at any point in time, given any reasonable doubt or suspicion as manifested in a formal query by any member university of the UAAP.


Tingin ko dapat gawin na ito ng UAAP. Not just for La Salle, but for all 8 member schools as well for preventive action na maulit pa itong mga pangyayaring ganito.


I don't think there should be oversight NOW. This only ought to happen in cases such as the proposed situation in this thread wherein one school is deemed to be complicit.

What I think should happen is that the UAAP should implement a rule regarding stricter rules for student-athletes to continue competing:

- There should be a specified graduation rate for all varsity players, to encourage players to actually finish schooling.
- Academic requirements of each school must be declared by each school to the UAAP, and grades must be submitted to the UAAP. I think that instead of requiring students to just pass, a grade cut-off significantly higher than just "satisfactory" or "pass" or its equivalent should be used as a standard. Student athletes ought to be model students too, not just jocks.
- Varsity players should actually be enrolled in a degree program (and ought to know what program they're enrolled in).
- Re: the masteral student rule, I think this is only acceptable if students actually graduate from the university's college unit. But masteral transferees should be disqualified from competition.
- Schools must actually verify PEPTCRs upon their submission (this is, after all, a DepEd and CHED-mandated regulation), in accordance with public policy.
- Student-athletes who are PEPTCR holders should serve a one-year residency requirement before being allowed to play, to allow for the necessary verification.

I think the current rules regarding basketball being a mandatory sport should stand.


Now, I turn to stubbornness:


i agee with engwalker...probation would have been enough,... the basis being the uaap had no basis at all he he! well, until of course they send us a clarification in reply to our request....

The UAAP board based its decision on the facts gathered in the course of its investigation.

I agree, however, that La Salle should be given the clarification it has asked for.


dapat siguro, ciguro they chould have been thorough enough to investigate matters and act on the facts they have all gathered...they should have recommended a course of action, which in turn, the board would vote upon..

here was no recommendation whatsoever, and still the board voted on the suspension, parang from the onset, dun din ang bagsak ng prusisyon, nagpaligoy-ligoy pa...

Who's they? The investigating committee? As far as I remember, they recommended suspension due to negligence. In any case, the facts were gathered, and the board, using the leverage that it was given by the rules, properly ruled for a suspension.


kung ako ang board, i would have let la salle play this season with conditions pertaining to the uaap rules and regulations such as forfeiting the last two season's games...

The rules allow the UAAP board to suspend a school. There is no strict provision regarding "complicity." The matter of complicity, and subsequently, of negligence, lies within the discretion of the board. It is clear that La Salle fielded an ineligible player in spite of being informed by DepEd that his PEPTCR was fake. This could have been avoided had La Salle bothered to conform to CHED Memorandum Order 15, dated July 2003, specifying verification requirements for PEPTCRs, in that same year, instead of waiting until August 2, 2005 to act. But did La Salle accord the matter of verification any importance? Apparently, there was "apparent lack of urgency."


then when they have gathered all the facts (including kay salgado and lacson) then should act upon this even in the middle of the season..

The facts were gathered during the course of the investigation. They acted before the season started, rightly so, to define the playing field. If it acted in the middle of the season, then there would have been a terrible waste of money on the part of the suspended party.

Also, the issue of Lacson and Salgado is a problem of La Salle, not the UAAP. Lacson and Salgado, as per La Salle, had a hand in the fake PEPTCRs. La Salle was the party most affected by the faking of the PEPTCRs, since it admitted the players as students, trained them, perhaps asked for some alumni help regarding possible benefits and amenities for the players, etc., only to find out that two people from the basketball team's management had a hand in faking the PEPTCRs. However, to this day, La Salle has strangely not done anything against Salgado and Lacson.


all they have had so far are speculations masquerading as facts, walang clearcut na bidensya, kaya nga siguro negligence ang verdict....but then again, they do whate ever they want, don't they, kaya 1 year suspension ang nakuha namin...

The facts showed, at least in the Board's judgment, that La Salle was negligent. Hence, the 1 year suspension. However, since basketball is a mandatory sport, the Board had no choice but to bar La Salle from all sporting events. They could not have allowed just a suspension in basketball without violating their own rules.

brian
07-17-2006, 04:18 AM
atenean blooded..

apparently, you are arguing on the premise and assumption that la salle had a hand in falsifying the pepctr documents, thus, we have been guilty of comlplicity, which clearly isn't the case...negligence has been the verdict, and my point of discussion borders on this fact alone...the issue of complicity should be thrown out the window until anyone comes up with any proof..

i believe that our course of action should have at least elicited some consideration from the board. as redundant as it may sound, may i remind you that it was us and us alone that has exposed the matter out to the public. our sanction should have been less, such as probation, under the extenuationg circumstances..

of course you have your own opinions regarding the punishment you deem we deserve, however, i beg to disagree with them..of course , the rules allow the uaap to suspend a school, but which rule indicates this? the last i heard, the board voted to suspend us... well then if this is the case, they certainly needn't have rules to begin with, when the rules are allowed to be superseded by number of votes anyway...but then again, there too is a rule which indicates that the fielding of an ineligible player warrants the forfeitures of the games he/them have played in, therefore, is the uaap unavailing of their rules when it in fact does not suit their own purposes? botohan na lang kung ganon di ba?

as far as i know, there were no recommendations by the investigative committee, they just handed their findings...and regarding the matter of la salle not reporting it immediately, which in fact they did when they were pretty much certain about it, you just can't be too cautious when it may involve the future of some kids ( benitez and gatchailan, btw, gfy, sino ba si benetiz? he he)

so when we did, right in the middle of our finals series vs feu, we were, right then and there, willing to forfeit the games, in fact forego the remaining one. what did rendon suggest? that they wait after the series because people had tcikets already and some other reasons...what then could we charge the uaap with, doesn't this constitute fraud? aba ala na palang bearing ang game, eh kung inatake pa ako sa puso sa suspense, kanda uga-uga na ako sa ka che-cheer sa la salle eh feu na pala ang champion...


but i agree with you, the rules allow the uaap to suspend any school..but was suspending la salle and all their other sports for 1 year justified? ...this is where our views differ...





The facts were gathered during the course of the investigation. They acted before the season started, rightly so, to define the playing field. If it acted in the middle of the season, then there would have been a terrible waste of money on the part of the suspended party.



see, you again are working on the premise that we are going to be suspended, for why would it be a waste of money, on the other hand, it could also generate income seeing how the current uaap has lost a number of it's sponsors...it would only be a waste of money on our part, if we believe, like you do, that, any other way we should and would be suspended too..which isn't clearly my perspective.

and if the facts were gathered during the course of their investigation, then why the hell are they taking so long responding to our request for a letter of clarification? i firmly believe that it's them, the uaap, who's dragging this issue TKC..

atenean_blooded
07-17-2006, 09:30 AM
atenean blooded..

apparently, you are arguing on the premise and assumption that la salle had a hand in falsifying the pepctr documents, thus, we have been guilty of comlplicity, which clearly isn't the case...negligence has been the verdict, and my point of discussion borders on this fact alone...the issue of complicity should be thrown out the window until anyone comes up with any proof..

I never argued on that premise. What gave you that idea?



i believe that our course of action should have at least elicited some consideration from the board. as redundant as it may sound, may i remind you that it was us and us alone that has exposed the matter out to the public. our sanction should have been less, such as probation, under the extenuationg circumstances..

The confession was belated and did not change the fact that La Salle continued fielding Benitez even after it was informed that his PEPTCR was fake. It also does not absolve La Salle of its negligence. With regard to the other courses of action, such as filing for a leave of absence only from men's basketball, there are rules which the board had to implement.



of course you have your own opinions regarding the punishment you deem we deserve, however, i beg to disagree with them..of course , the rules allow the uaap to suspend a school, but which rule indicates this? the last i heard, the board voted to suspend us... well then if this is the case, they certainly needn't have rules to begin with, when the rules are allowed to be superseded by number of votes anyway...but then again, there too is a rule which indicates that the fielding of an ineligible player warrants the forfeitures of the games he/them have played in, therefore, is the uaap unavailing of their rules when it in fact does not suit their own purposes? botohan na lang kung ganon di ba?

The rules provide the board the necessary authority to suspend any member school. Naturally, a suspension vote would require a vote (also indicated in the rules, as I recall).

The forfeiture of games is automatic. Other penalties are left to the board's discretion.



as far as i know, there were no recommendations by the investigative committee, they just handed their findings...and regarding the matter of la salle not reporting it immediately, which in fact they did when they were pretty much certain about it, you just can't be too cautious when it may involve the future of some kids ( benitez and gatchailan, btw, gfy, sino ba si benetiz? he he)

In that case, where was the delicadeza? Why didn't Pumaren stop fielding Benitez? Why did the OSD sit on the issue for months, citing "apparent lack of urgency that the matter deserved?"



so when we did, right in the middle of our finals series vs feu, we were, right then and there, willing to forfeit the games, in fact forego the remaining one. what did rendon suggest? that they wait after the series because people had tcikets already and some other reasons...what then could we charge the uaap with, doesn't this constitute fraud? aba ala na palang bearing ang game, eh kung inatake pa ako sa puso sa suspense, kanda uga-uga na ako sa ka che-cheer sa la salle eh feu na pala ang champion...

Well, had the board been informed earlier, and had La Salle taken action earlier, there would have been no need for Rendon to make that suggestion. The simple reason being, La Salle being relegated to the bottom of the standings. Earlier action might have allowed for a board decision that you would have found more favorable.



but i agree with you, the rules allow the uaap to suspend any school..but was suspending la salle and all their other sports for 1 year justified? ...this is where our views differ...

As of now, we can probably agree to disagree.






The facts were gathered during the course of the investigation. They acted before the season started, rightly so, to define the playing field. If it acted in the middle of the season, then there would have been a terrible waste of money on the part of the suspended party.



see, you again are working on the premise that we are going to be suspended, for why would it be a waste of money, on the other hand, it could also generate income seeing how the current uaap has lost a number of it's sponsors...it would only be a waste of money on our part, if we believe, like you do, that, any other way we should and would be suspended too..which isn't clearly my perspective.

This is a simplistic attempt at argument. The simple point was assuming the board, after a meeting, would vote for suspension (assuming the worst), then it would be better for the decision to be made before the season starts.

Waste of money: I assume that there is some sort of investment that goes into preparations for the UAAP. A decision before the start of the season at least allows you to keep the money that you would have spent on a UAAP campaign to spend elsewhere.


and if the facts were gathered during the course of their investigation, then why the hell are they taking so long responding to our request for a letter of clarification? i firmly believe that it's them, the uaap, who's dragging this issue TKC..

I think your suspension has ceased to be an issue for the UAAP, unfortunately. I actually want the board to reply to your request for clarification. I think even La Salle deserves to know why it got its punishment.

Howard the Duck
07-17-2006, 10:30 AM
Why don't you people create a new topic?

Again, please stay on topic. Or create a new thread. That'll be better.

brian
07-17-2006, 11:20 AM
pasensya ulit howard.. beats me too why we always end up discussing this matter...

atenean blooded,

you have valid points. i'll agree as much. however, from where i sit, it's all a matter of perception....and it is still my belief that, notwithstanding the validity of your arguments (but who can argue with rules?)* the 1 year suspension isn't justified....yun lang naman ang pinagtatalunan natin despite all the events that transpired,

correct ka rin dito, other penalties are left to the discretion of the board, more the reason for us not to trust it, and apparently, rightly so..

i propose we leave it as that for now and yes, let's agree to disagree....

now let's get back to the topic..nakakhiya kay howard..

on topic..

kung ako ang uaap, i'd do without the voting on issues regarding the league, i'd push for the creation of a new set of rules which is clearcut and not shouldn't based on the interpretations of any board members for that matter...

at gagawin ko na isa na lang ang magdedesisyon re issues...i suggest the commisioner of the league, whoever he may be........

biruin mo naman, lahat ng bagay, maski technical na issues sa basketball, binobothan ng board...pati mga protesta, pagdating sa huli, kampi-kampihan...tas tatameme lang ang commisioner.

dapat bumoboto lang sila when electing new set of officials or whatever meron sila or kung ano ang soup of the day nila for lunch..

oca
07-17-2006, 12:56 PM
^
Kailan pa ba nangyari na ang mga naghahari-harian ay kusang loob na bibitaw sa kapangyarihan na iginawad sa kanila?

Para sa UAAP, magandang isipin na magkaroon ito ng isang professional at full time tagapagpatkbo ng liga. At ang Board ay magiging policy making body na lang.

Pero gaya ng una kong binanggit, "Mangyari kaya iyon?".

Malabo. Dahil kung nasa lugar ang collective thinking ng mga iyan, sa simula pa lang, hindi na dapat nagkaroon ng maraming issue ang liga.

bigfreeze_bibby
07-17-2006, 12:57 PM
I don't think there should be oversight NOW. This only ought to happen in cases such as the proposed situation in this thread wherein one school is deemed to be complicit.

What I think should happen is that the UAAP should implement a rule regarding stricter rules for student-athletes to continue competing:

- There should be a specified graduation rate for all varsity players, to encourage players to actually finish schooling.
- Academic requirements of each school must be declared by each school to the UAAP, and grades must be submitted to the UAAP. I think that instead of requiring students to just pass, a grade cut-off significantly higher than just "satisfactory" or "pass" or its equivalent should be used as a standard. Student athletes ought to be model students too, not just jocks.
- Varsity players should actually be enrolled in a degree program (and ought to know what program they're enrolled in).
- Re: the masteral student rule, I think this is only acceptable if students actually graduate from the university's college unit. But masteral transferees should be disqualified from competition.
- Schools must actually verify PEPTCRs upon their submission (this is, after all, a DepEd and CHED-mandated regulation), in accordance with public policy.
- Student-athletes who are PEPTCR holders should serve a one-year residency requirement before being allowed to play, to allow for the necessary verification.

I think the current rules regarding basketball being a mandatory sport should stand.


I don't see anything wrong if the UAAP goes to making efforts in overseeing the recruitment process as part of their routine. It will be also for their benefit in the long run just to ensure that recruitment is worry free. Actually, okay sa kin tong mga rules that you have formulated. I am not sure but I think some of the rules you have stated are already implemented by the local NCAA. Need to check pa rin naman about it.

brian
07-17-2006, 01:16 PM
^
Kailan pa ba nangyari na ang mga naghahari-harian ay kusang loob na bibitaw sa kapangyarihan na iginawad sa kanila?

Para sa UAAP, magandang isipin na magkaroon ito ng isang professional at full time tagapagpatkbo ng liga. At ang Board ay magiging policy making body na lang.

Pero gaya ng una kong binanggit, "Mangyari kaya iyon?".

Malabo. Dahil kung nasa lugar ang collective thinking ng mga iyan, sa simula pa lang, hindi na dapat nagkaroon ng maraming issue ang liga.


malaking agree ako dyan...pero tama ka, mangyayari kaya iyon? unang-una, sa dagdag bayarin palang di na sila papayag sa tingin ko maski makakabuti sa liga...

atenean_blooded
07-17-2006, 07:52 PM
brian:

I think that there are certain things that we have to leave to the board. After all, it's a reality that no set of rules can possibly encompass every possible situation, and in light of that, we still have to have a body that can adjudicate to ensure that justice is served.

I do agree that the Board should be the last group to judge protests regarding the breaks of the game. I don't know if anyone on that Board other than Palou, for example, has even set foot on a hardcourt to play basketball (image of Matibag comes to mind).

Out_Of_The_Blue
07-19-2006, 10:57 PM
What was the Board's verdict on Gatchalian and Benitez? Were they victims or accessories to the committed offense? If they were found to be victims, what kind of measures did the board rule out to provide justice to these innocent players and what actions did they take to prevent similar cases from happening again in the future? If they were found to be accessories, what penalties aside from being taken out of their schools were meted on them and on their co-accessories to the offense committed?

Can anybody from our green friends provide the factual answers and enlighten us?

gfy
07-20-2006, 07:01 AM
The tragedy Out is this.: Obviously Benitez and Gatchalian knew and were willing conspirators. But would or could they have done it by themselves? The two guys lost 3 years and suffered shame and ridicule. They could have stayed at JRU and would have been playing now in the NCAA. Benitiz' team Cagayan went bankrupt midway in the tournament.

Same thing with Bughao. If Ateneo did its homework, it should have not recruited him. And Bughao could have applied at another school and played in another league where there is no 7-year rule.

glock23
07-20-2006, 02:25 PM
^^^if indeed there is more than meets the eye in your opinion, then feel free to let us know about it.