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insiderinfo
03-09-2006, 01:41 PM
From the post of tambay_sa_recto at the tsismis thread:

Sa isang inuman ng mga dating manlalaro ng UAAP, nabanggit na may isang pinananabikang manlalaro na hindi na pala pwedeng isali. Hindi dahil sa edad kundi dahil sa tagal na niyang nakatapos ng high school. Batu-batu sa asul na langit, tamaan huwag magalit!

I believe Ronnie Bughao is the one being alluded to in this post. Rumors are going around that he won't be playing for the Blue Eagles due to the "7 year out of high school" rule. If true, what a big blow to the campaign of the Eagles for Season 69.

chipanggo
03-09-2006, 01:53 PM
and he's also trying out for the Teletech PBL team. anyone knows the real score?

bluestorck
03-09-2006, 02:17 PM
can anyone shed light on this matter pls.

razor
03-09-2006, 05:21 PM
According to Butch Maniego - aka roadwarrior - at PEX:



he's not playing sa uaap this year, being a '99 HS grad


So I gues we can now call Ronnie Bughao the "ex-Tamaraw," the "ex-Red Lion" and the "ex-Blue Eagle."

MonL
03-09-2006, 05:33 PM
According to Butch Maniego aka roadwarrior at PEX:



he's not playing sa uaap this year, being a '99 HS grad


So I gues we can now call Ronnie Bughao the "ex-Tamarraw," "ex-Red Lion" and "ex-Blue Eagle."








So why is he still playing? Why is he still a huge part of the Eagles' campaigns when it would be of no use to the Eagles this coming season 69 at mawawala din siya sa rotation? Didnt they figure this out before he took up residence? Nakakalungkot kung totoo. True nga ba?

Joescoundrel
03-09-2006, 07:11 PM
I have a silly question: When Ronnie Bughao transferred to Ateneo his transfer papers indicated he graduated from high school in 2000 right? I would like to think the Registrar of his last school (before Ateneo) did its work thoroughly before admitting him into their institution. If that is the case then what's with this "he graduated in '99" scenario now?

Because if we go by these documents then we can only surmise any or a combination of the following:

1. Bughao lied to his last school.

2. His last school (or at least its Registrar) did not do its job properly, i.e. verification of the authenticity of a student's credentials when transferring.

Of course I could be wrong. As someone who really wants Blue to strut his stuff in the UAAP perhaps someone more in the know could confirm if his transfer papers indicated 1999 or 2000 as his graduation year in high school.

And speaking of verification, why the hell didn't Ateneo team management do its own scut work to verify his papers? Lets face it, Blue hasn't exactly been a model citizen. He has been controversial to say the least. I would think the forst thing any responsible team management would do would be to verify and scrutinize his papers.

Why is he still playing in the off-season tournaments? Simple: because he is still officially enrolled in Ateneo and the tournament rules of these other leagues allow him to.

He's trying out with Harbour Centre and TeleTech.

Wang-Bu
03-09-2006, 07:40 PM
Aba at ngayon pa nagduda?

Alam naman ng lahat na hindi santo si Ronnie Bughao, nagtaka pa kayo na may ganyan siyang sabit.

tambay_sa_recto
03-09-2006, 08:11 PM
Hokay, ah! Nanganak 'yung thread ko.

Dagdag lang: Kapag nagsali ka sa koponan mo ng manlalaro na hindi eligible, nandadaya ka. Kapag nag-aksaya ka ng pera't panahon sa manlalarong balak mo pa lang isali sa koponan mo tapos lumabas na hindi na pala eligible, tatanga-tanga ka. O, mga matatalinong Atenista, sino'ng BOBO ngayon?

christian
03-09-2006, 10:38 PM
san po ba nag high school si Bughao? at gano katagal siya sa FEU bago mag Beda? sayang naman, idol ko pa naman si Ronnie... thanks

atenean_blooded
03-10-2006, 12:35 AM
Hokay, ah! Nanganak 'yung thread ko.

Dagdag lang: Kapag nagsali ka sa koponan mo ng manlalaro na hindi eligible, nandadaya ka. Kapag nag-aksaya ka ng pera't panahon sa manlalarong balak mo pa lang isali sa koponan mo tapos lumabas na hindi na pala eligible, tatanga-tanga ka. O, mga matatalinong Atenista, sino'ng BOBO ngayon?




Ganito lang kasimple yan.

Saang liga ineligible si Ronnie Bughao?

Sa UAAP.

Naglaro na ba si Bughao sa UAAP?

Hindi.

So, may isyu ba tungkol sa pag-field ng isang ineligible player sa UAAP?

Meron. Kaso hindi Ateneo ang may isyu nun.

Nakapaglaro ba si Bughao para sa koponan ng Ateneo?

Oo.

Saan?

Sa ibang liga, hindi sa UAAP.

May ibig sabihin ba ito para sa UAAP campaign ng Ateneo?

Meron. Walang Ronnie Bughao, at kailangang magstep-up ng ibang mga guardiya.1

Kapag hindi mo pa gets yun, ewan ko pa.

tambay_sa_recto
03-10-2006, 06:24 AM
Kapag hindi mo pa gets yun, ewan ko pa.



Ang tanong naman, kaibigan, eh hindi kung na-gets ko kundi, "BAKIT NGAYON LANG NINYO NA-GETS?" May lumapit na manlalaro sa inyo noong isang taon, magaling kaya pumayag kayong maghintay bago siya pwedeng maglaro sa UAAP. Binigyan ninyo ng scholarship, ibinahay at kung anu-ano pa. Maganda ang ipinakita niya. Malaki ang naitulong niya sa pagkapanalo n'yo sa FMC. Kilig na kilig na kayo at gumawa na kayo ng mga kanya-kanya n'yong line up para sa darating na Season 69 (please see other thread). Sa lahat ng mga listahan ninyo, walang duda na pasok na pasok na siya. Siya ang papalit sa nabakanteng pwesto ni LA Tenorio at ang pinagdedebatihan n'yo na lang, eh, kung sino pa sa Team B ang aakyat. Ngayon, isang liga na lang bago mag-UAAP, pumutok ito. Halatang masyado kayong nabighani sa galing niyang maglaro na wala sa inyong nakaalala ng "7 year rule" ng UAAP na wala sa NCAA. Ngayon sasabihin ninyo na it's OK, no harm done, at the team management will have to this and the players will have to do that. Hindi ba naman may pagkahipokrito ang dating nito? Ayaw pa kasing aminin na nagkamali kayo at iindahin ninyo ang hindi niya pagsali sa darating na UAAP. Simple lang, pare. Gets mo?

BLUE HORSE
03-10-2006, 07:10 AM
Will the UAAP board be asked to decide the fate of Bughao?* *???* FEU should have the answers because they have a copy of his high school transcripts.* Prior to SBC, Bughao plied his trade for FEU.* Was Ronnie Bughao above board with Ateneo team officials concerning his eligibility?

Pasalamat ang Ateneo that they have other players who play the same position as Blue trying to make varsity.* Granted, they do not have the moxie and experience as Blue, hindi hamak na masmatanda siya sa mga bata.* Pero sayang pa rin.

I hope Blue continues his education and ends up with an Ateneo degree. Kung matuloy siya sa PBL, there is no turning back.

Mateen Cleaves
03-10-2006, 07:35 AM
No need for the UAAP Board. Kung nagbabalak na siya mag-PBL via Teletech or Harbour, that's forest fire kind of smoke coming from the Bughao camp there. Pasalamat ang Ateneo na ngayon lumabas yan. At hindi sa kalagitnaan ng UAAP, tapos bigla na lang bubulagain ng ibang university.

Pero ang siste, ayon nga kay t_s_r, ay bakit ngayon lang?!! Para que pa napunta sina Anton Montinola at Mark Molina sa FEU kung hindi rin puedeng pagtanungan ng mga ganyang bagay?

5FootCarrot
03-10-2006, 07:56 AM
So I gues we can now call Ronnie Bughao...the "ex-Blue Eagle."
Nope, not yet. As far as I know, he is still officially enrolled in the Ateneo and plans to stay on and finish his education there. Also, he is still allowed to play basketball for the school, just not in the UAAP (if it is indeed true that he can't anymore).

Therefore, he is still a Blue Eagle.

EDITED TO ADD: Maybe this thread should be moved to the Eagles' Nest forum since it's all about one of our own?

oca
03-10-2006, 08:18 AM
So I gues we can now call Ronnie Bughao...the "ex-Blue Eagle."
Nope, not yet. As far as I know, he is still officially enrolled in the Ateneo and plans to stay on and finish his education there. Also, he is still allowed to play basketball for the school, just not in the UAAP (if it is indeed true that he can't anymore).

Therefore, he is still a Blue Eagle.

EDITED TO ADD: Maybe this thread should be moved to the Eagles' Nest forum since it's all about one of our own?


Issues on eligibilty are matters of interest for the whole basketball community.

Kaya with respect to the "eligibility rule" being raised, this thread should remain here.

gameface_one
03-10-2006, 08:26 AM
So I gues we can now call Ronnie Bughao...the "ex-Blue Eagle."
Nope, not yet. As far as I know, he is still officially enrolled in the Ateneo and plans to stay on and finish his education there. Also, he is still allowed to play basketball for the school, just not in the UAAP (if it is indeed true that he can't anymore).

Therefore, he is still a Blue Eagle.

EDITED TO ADD: Maybe this thread should be moved to the Eagles' Nest forum since it's all about one of our own?



Kaya with respect to the "eligibility rule" being raised, this thread should remain here.




Agree with Oca. Carrot, maybe you can have a separate topic on Ronnie Bughao in the Blue Eagles' Nest forum. Maybe you can focus on the effect of this issue on the campaign of the Blue Eagles' in season 69.
Issues on eligibilty are matters of interest for the whole basketball community.

Mateen Cleaves
03-10-2006, 09:00 AM
Perhaps you can edit the thread title to emphasize that the discussion should be in the direction of "eligibility" and not "bughao". Then Bughao as an Ateneo player can be debated and discussed in the Blue forum.

oca
03-10-2006, 09:16 AM
I have a silly question: When Ronnie Bughao transferred to Ateneo his transfer papers indicated he graduated from high school in 2000 right? I would like to think the Registrar of his last school (before Ateneo) did its work thoroughly before admitting him into their institution. If that is the case then what's with this "he graduated in '99" scenario now?

Because if we go by these documents then we can only surmise any or a combination of the following:

1. Bughao lied to his last school.

2. His last school (or at least its Registrar) did not do its job properly, i.e. verification of the authenticity of a student's credentials when transferring.

Of course I could be wrong. As someone who really wants Blue to strut his stuff in the UAAP perhaps someone more in the know could confirm if his transfer papers indicated 1999 or 2000 as his graduation year in high school.

And speaking of verification, why the hell didn't Ateneo team management do its own scut work to verify his papers? Lets face it, Blue hasn't exactly been a model citizen. He has been controversial to say the least. I would think the forst thing any responsible team management would do would be to verify and scrutinize his papers.

Why is he still playing in the off-season tournaments? Simple: because he is still officially enrolled in Ateneo and the tournament rules of these other leagues allow him to.

He's trying out with Harbour Centre and TeleTech.


San Beda was Bughao's last school. San Beda is an NCAA member school.

Until a person of authority makes a confirmation, let as assume this "7 year out of hs rule" is the same for both the NCAA and the UAAP.

Scenario 1: The student-athlete actually graduated in 1999.

Why would an NCAA member not allow the student-athlete to play?

If his status come school year 2006-07 would violate this rule, then the NCAA member would simply not field him for Season 82 of the NCAA.

In this case, Bughao would have played 3 years. Good for both the player and the school.

Scenario 2: Bugaho may have lied, declaring year 2000 i/o 1999.

Before playing for an NCAA member school, in this case San Beda, the student athlete was actually enrolled in a UAAP member school, at FEU.

Any student transferring presents his transfer credentials issued by the last school he enrolled at. In this case, it was FEU. FEU issued the transfer credentials which was used by San Beda as basis for admitting Bughao.

On matters like this, San Beda would assume the regularity of the documents issued by FEU. But, since these documents are hand carried by the student, SOP is, after admission there will be a school-to-school verification of the same. If the documents/ information were verified by FEU, indicates that Bughao finished hs in 2000, then to San Beda, Bughao finished hs in 2000. No issue.

So, if there was lying, Bughao lied to FEU. It was the responsibility of FEU to determine the authencity of the HS credentials submitted by Bughao.

Pero let me ask first, "Was FEU Bughao's first stop after HS?"

Kung hindi, then mas hahaba ang usapin...hindi na ako makikisali ryan.

Pero kung FEU ang first stop ni Bughao, and there was misdeclaration/ falsification, paano nalusutan ang FEU?

On the points raised by josecpundrel, it is apparent, labas sa usapan ang last school ni Bughao.

The problem would have started at the backyard of a UAAP school and will end at the UAAP.

insiderinfo
03-10-2006, 09:24 AM
Word is that Ronnie Bughao's records with FEU stated that he graduated in 1999. I am assuming these are the records that FEU turned over to San Beda when Bughao moved. I heard, however, that the records that San Beda turned over to Ateneo certified that Bughao graduated in 2000. Why the discrepancy?

oca
03-10-2006, 09:35 AM
Word is that Ronnie Bughao's records with FEU stated that he graduated in 1999.* I am assuming these are the records that FEU turned over to San Beda when Bughao moved.* I heard, however, that the records that San Beda turned over to Ateneo certified that Bughao graduated in 2000.* Why the discrepancy?




Nalusutan ang San Beda ?

Naisahan ang Athletic Moderator ng San Beda, si Senor Badolato ?

oca
03-10-2006, 09:57 AM
Word is that Ronnie Bughao's records with FEU stated that he graduated in 1999.* I am assuming these are the records that FEU turned over to San Beda when Bughao moved.* I heard, however, that the records that San Beda turned over to Ateneo certified that Bughao graduated in 2000.* Why the discrepancy?




"I heard" baga ang sinulat mo?

Let us not complicate the issue further.

Personaly, I wouldn't think Bughao would have lied and declared he finished hs in year 2000.

Why?

1. At that time na magsimula siya mag-aral sa college, alam ba nya na magpapalipat-lipat siya ng paaralan?

Ang tindi nya naman para makinita niya yun....

2. At the time Bughao enrolled at FEU he definitely had no eligibility problems and qualified to play 4 years at least. Hence, there was no motive.

3. Now, when he transferred, would he lie to San Beda?

He was eligible to play for at least 3 years. Di ka pa ba matutuwa ruon?

Besides, San Beda would not be a party to that. Or even negligent in verifying the docs submitted by Bughao.

Kung gugustuhin lang ng San Beda gumawa ng kalokohan, eh di hindi na sana sila nangangarap mag-champion muli after 28 years.

4. At kung ang docs na nasa Ateneo shows year 2000 and not 1999, ano naman ang motive ng San Beda para sadyang maliin yung detalyeng iyong? Lilipat nga ng paaralan yung player, bakit mo naman dadagdagan yung playing years niya? Makikinabang ba ang San Beda sa pagpalit nila ng detalyeng iyon?

5. Dinoktor yung 2000 na nasa document na hawak ng Ateneo?

Uubra ba yan sa Ateneo? Besides, Ateneo would have also verified the same with San Beda. Kung 2000 ang nakalagay, ibig sabihin, 2000 ang detalyeng nakalagay sa document na nanggaling sa FEU.

Hindi maaring baguhin ang isang detalye na nagmula sa pinang-galingan paaralan. Kung 1999 ang tama, magsisimula ang kamalian ng detalyeng 2000 sa pinakasimula.

Saan ba nagsimula ang kwento ni Bughao?

atenean_blooded
03-10-2006, 10:26 AM
Kapag hindi mo pa gets yun, ewan ko pa.



Ang tanong naman, kaibigan, eh hindi kung na-gets ko kundi, "BAKIT NGAYON LANG NINYO NA-GETS?"

Kasi ngayon lang iniharap sa amin ang isyung ito.

Ngayon lang nalaman, ngayon agad naaksyunan.

So, ano'ng problema mo?



May lumapit na manlalaro sa inyo noong isang taon, magaling kaya pumayag kayong maghintay bago siya pwedeng maglaro sa UAAP. Binigyan ninyo ng scholarship, ibinahay at kung anu-ano pa. Maganda ang ipinakita niya. Malaki ang naitulong niya sa pagkapanalo n'yo sa FMC. Kilig na kilig na kayo at gumawa na kayo ng mga kanya-kanya n'yong line up para sa darating na Season 69 (please see other thread). Sa lahat ng mga listahan ninyo, walang duda na pasok na pasok na siya. Siya ang papalit sa nabakanteng pwesto ni LA Tenorio at ang pinagdedebatihan n'yo na lang, eh, kung sino pa sa Team B ang aakyat. Ngayon, isang liga na lang bago mag-UAAP, pumutok ito. Halatang masyado kayong nabighani sa galing niyang maglaro na wala sa inyong nakaalala ng "7 year rule" ng UAAP na wala sa NCAA. Ngayon sasabihin ninyo na it's OK, no harm done, at the team management will have to this and the players will have to do that.

Medyo simplistic, pero pwede na ang analysis.


Hindi ba naman may pagkahipokrito ang dating nito?

Hindi. Kung masasabi mo kung bakit may pagkahipokrito, baka sige, may pag-usapan pa tayo.



Ayaw pa kasing aminin na nagkamali kayo at iindahin ninyo ang hindi niya pagsali sa darating na UAAP. Simple lang, pare. Gets mo?

Kung hindi namin inaamin na nagkamali kami, e di bakit hindi na nga namin paglalaruin si Bughao sa darating na UAAP?

Napakasimple ng sinabi ko. Hindi mo yata na-gets.

gameface_one
03-10-2006, 10:39 AM
tambay/atenan_blooded, tone down guys. Let's discuss this intellectually. Lessen the emotions pls.

Kid Cubao
03-10-2006, 11:20 AM
tanong lang: is the 7-yr rule also enforced in the NCAA? kasi sakaling hindi, then we can surmise that ronnie bughao is unaware of such a policy in the UAAP.

supposing that ronnie bughao is deemed ineligible to play in the UAAP, technically he can still play in the non-UAAP tournaments like the fr. martin and HAIL, for instance, where there are less restrictions on eligibility requirements.

insiderinfo
03-10-2006, 11:41 AM
Word is that Ronnie Bughao's records with FEU stated that he graduated in 1999. I am assuming these are the records that FEU turned over to San Beda when Bughao moved. I heard, however, that the records that San Beda turned over to Ateneo certified that Bughao graduated in 2000. Why the discrepancy?




"I heard" baga ang sinulat mo?

Let us not complicate the issue further.

Personaly, I wouldn't think Bughao would have lied and declared he finished hs in year 2000.

Why?

1. At that time na magsimula siya mag-aral sa college, alam ba nya na magpapalipat-lipat siya ng paaralan?

Ang tindi nya naman para makinita niya yun....

2. At the time Bughao enrolled at FEU he definitely had no eligibility problems and qualified to play 4 years at least. Hence, there was no motive.

3. Now, when he transferred, would he lie to San Beda?

He was eligible to play for at least 3 years. Di ka pa ba matutuwa ruon?

Besides, San Beda would not be a party to that. Or even negligent in verifying the docs submitted by Bughao.

Kung gugustuhin lang ng San Beda gumawa ng kalokohan, eh di hindi na sana sila nangangarap mag-champion muli after 28 years.

4. At kung ang docs na nasa Ateneo shows year 2000 and not 1999, ano naman ang motive ng San Beda para sadyang maliin yung detalyeng iyong? Lilipat nga ng paaralan yung player, bakit mo naman dadagdagan yung playing years niya? Makikinabang ba ang San Beda sa pagpalit nila ng detalyeng iyon?

5. Dinoktor yung 2000 na nasa document na hawak ng Ateneo?

Uubra ba yan sa Ateneo? Besides, Ateneo would have also verified the same with San Beda. Kung 2000 ang nakalagay, ibig sabihin, 2000 ang detalyeng nakalagay sa document na nanggaling sa FEU.

Hindi maaring baguhin ang isang detalye na nagmula sa pinang-galingan paaralan. Kung 1999 ang tama, magsisimula ang kamalian ng detalyeng 2000 sa pinakasimula.

Saan ba nagsimula ang kwento ni Bughao?



I don't think my raising the discrepancies in Bughao's complicates the situation. It, in fact, seeks clarification. The fact is the situation is complicated already, involving 3 of the most well-known schools in Manila. I did hear about this info but I am not so reckless to post something here that isn't verified.

Bughao declared with FEU that he graduated in 1999 which probably should remove suspicion that he lied to his school. Things didn't work out with FEU. San Beda was his next stop. Here is where is gets a bit muddled.

San Beda receives documents from FEU. What did those documents say? 1999 or 2000? If it's 1999, how come when San Beda certified Bughao's documents when he moved to Ateneo, it already said 2000? If it said 2000, was it a simple error on FEU's part or a deliberate effort to put one over San Beda?

The discrepancies in the records of Bughao can be attributed to either 1) a simple error or 2) a deliberate effort. Which one is it? Better yet, why?

Mang_Roger
03-10-2006, 01:01 PM
Bughao declared with FEU that he graduated in 1999 which probably should remove suspicion that he lied to his school.

Personal mo bang nalaman ito o bunga lang ng haka-haka?


Things didn't work out with FEU.* San Beda was his next stop.* Here is where is gets a bit muddled.

Bit muddled? Kung pagbabatayan ang mga kongklusyon mo na di mo pa napapatunayan na may personal kang kaalaman sa mga basehan, mahirap itong paniwalaan.


San Beda receives documents from FEU.* What did those documents say?* 1999 or 2000?* If it's 1999, how come when San Beda certified Bughao's documents when he moved to Ateneo, it already said 2000?

Inuulit ko, personal mo bang nalaman ito o bunga lang ng haka-haka?



Simple lang naman ang nangyari. May problema sa eligibility si Ronnie na natuklasan ng Ateneo bago ito maglaro sa UAAP. Sila mismo nagsabi, di papalaruin. Tapos.

Ang problema lang sa iba eh masyado lang ginagawang mainit ang usapan upang punahan o pintasan ang isang iskuwelahan. May angking galit kasi o di naman ay balak idamay ang iba sa sinapit ng kanilang paaralan.

Pilit binibigyan ng malisya ang pangyayari upang akusahan ng di-umanoy pandaraya ang isang kolehiyo.
Sa mga nangyaring ito, alin ba sa mga iskuwelahan ang puwedeng makinabang kung sakali ngang naiba ang nakasaad na taon sa dokumento ni Ronnie? Wala! Sa madaling salita walang MOTIBO!

Kung sino Ronnie naman ang ating susuriin, isang matibay na batayan ang kinakailangan upang masabi na siya ang may kagagawan. Mahirap mag-akusa na ang batayan ay puro haka-haka lang. Tsismis ang tawag dun.

Joescoundrel
03-10-2006, 01:35 PM
I'm with InsiderInfo on this one. As someone who wants to see Ronnie Bughao kick ass in the UAAP I would dearly love to find out once and for all what his records actually said, 1999 or 2000? Frankly I think at least 95% of the blame for this whole mess should be laid directly at the feet of Ateneo team management. Regardless of how good a player is his papers should be thoroughly scrutinized. For godsakes, what good is a player to the school if he isn't even eligible to play in the first place? I used to work as a school registrar for a small Nursing school and transfer students in particular were always submitted to thorough scrutiny, because we had to make certain we weren't going to wind up harboring some miscreant.

That this should happen to Ateneo of all schools is disgraceful! I'm not about to be a hypocrite about it: the primary - if not the only - reason Blue is in Ateneo is because we want him to play in the UAAP. He made it through the entrance process, but I wonder about the admissions process. Because part of the admissions process would be the verification of his papers. A discrepancy in high school graduation would raise minor alarms (clerical error / honest mistake) or major alarms (falsification of a school document, punishable under special laws and other applicable statutes).

This is why I want to know the whole story - and why I am taking this stand. If Blue can no longer play in the UAAP it would be a tremendous loss for Ateneo, but its not going to be the end of Ateneo Basketball.

So lets go back to the original question that will settle all of this: WHEN DID RONNIE BUGHAO GRADUATE FROM HIGH SCHOOL, 1999 OR 2000?

tambay_sa_recto
03-10-2006, 01:54 PM
So, ano'ng problema mo?

Medyo simplistic, pero pwede na ang analysis.

Kung masasabi mo kung bakit may pagkahipokrito, baka sige, may pag-usapan pa tayo.

Kung hindi namin inaamin na nagkamali kami, e di bakit hindi na nga namin paglalaruin si Bughao sa darating na UAAP?

Napakasimple ng sinabi ko. Hindi mo yata na-gets.




Nakuuu! Napakahirap talagang gisingin ang nagtutulog-tulugan. Tatantanan na kita, pare. Nakakahiya na kasi sa karamihan dito na nakakaintindi. Alam kong sasagutin mo pa ito dahil hindi mo kayang tiisin na hindi ikaw ang may huling salita. Pagkatapos mong sumagot, meme ka na ulit nang mahimbing, ha.

oca
03-10-2006, 01:56 PM
I don't think my raising the discrepancies in Bughao's complicates the situation.* It, in fact, seeks clarification.* The fact is the situation is complicated already, involving 3 of the most well-known schools in Manila.* I did hear about this info but I am not so reckless to post something here that isn't verified.*

Bughao declared with FEU that he graduated in 1999 which probably should remove suspicion that he lied to his school.* Things didn't work out with FEU.* San Beda was his next stop.* Here is where is gets a bit muddled.*

San Beda receives documents from FEU.* What did those documents say?* 1999 or 2000?* If it's 1999, how come when San Beda certified Bughao's documents when he moved to Ateneo, it already said 2000?* If it said 2000, was it a simple error on FEU's part or a deliberate effort to put one over San Beda?*

The discrepancies in the records of Bughao can be attributed to either 1) a simple error or 2) a deliberate effort.* Which one is it?* Better yet, why?





If you have carefully read the issue raised, it was whether Bughao graduated from HS in 1999 or 2000. Period.

Then you made your "I heard..." post. Which asked , "..how come when San Beda certified..it already said 2000?".

This is another issue, because it questions the integrity of the school who issued the transfer credential.

For how do you clarify the matter when infact you raise another issue ?

You did raise the possibility that there was error commited on the part of FEU when Bughao transfered to San Beda. Also asked , "The discrepancies in the records of Bughao can be attributed to either 1) a simple error or 2) a deliberate effort. *Which one is it? *Better yet, why?"

Well, all these came after your initial past. Not with it. Hence your first post deserved the comments/ replies/ rebuttal it is getting.

But still, there is the presumption of regularity on docs issued between schools. Once verified it becomes binding to all parties.To think otherwise is outright wrong and malicious.

Agent 008
03-10-2006, 03:43 PM
Ang di ko maintindihan ay kung ano ang nais ng iba na ipaamin sa Ateneo? Na nagkamali sila sa pagkuha kay Bughao? Na nasayang ang ginastos para sa isang player na hindi makakalaro sa UAAP? Kung talagang di na qualified si Bughao maglaro ng UAAP di okay, sige, aminin na nating nasayang ang nagastos sa kanyang recruitment. Ano ba ang masama dito? Wala. Bad investment..tapos.

May nagawa bang illegal ang Ateneo na dapat nilang panagutan? Wala.
Naglaro ba si Bughao sa isang liga na di siya puwede? Hindi.
Paglalaruin ba siya sa UAAP? Kung hindi eligible ay Hindi.
Nakita ba ang irregularity bago magsimula ang UAAP? Oo.
May ginagawa na bang nararapat na aksyon para siguraduhing walang illegal na gagawin and Ateneo? Oo.

Ano pa ba ang kailangang pagusapan dito? Nililinaw na ang documentation. Kung di puwede ay hindi siya maglalaro sa UAAP.. "Simplistic" mang maitutring ay sorry na lang dahil talagang ganun lang talaga ka-simple kasi. Ni wala man lang nagpo-protesta sa eligibility so ano ba talaga ang problema? Kung hindi eligible, hindi siya maglalaro.

Personally, nagpapasalamat ako na lumabas na ito ngayon. Kung sino man ang nakakita nitong technicality na ito...maraming salamat sa yo kaibigan.

chba_dude
03-10-2006, 04:58 PM
My take on the issue:

(Ateneo pertaining to management)

Did Ateneo make a mistake?

Yes. Bughao was taken in to play UAAP ball without enough verification.

Did Ateneo do something wrong?

No. They found out about it before the UAAP season and obviously will not let him play UAAP ball anymore.

What are the chances of Ateneo basketball next UAAP season?

Dimmer chances. But not impossible. Ronnie will be a big loss. If you haven't seen JC showcasing his offensive prowess, Macky ably quarterbacking the Ateneo* in the FMC, Jai ripping the nets and Japeth rattling rims in the HAIL, you would have been probably misled to believe that it's now impossible. Plus there is now room for a guard to step up for the Blue Eagles. I'm betting for a Salamat chance to shine.


At least Ronnie has the option to continue to get his Ateneo education and a chance to still be a Blue Eagle in the minor leagues. Kudos to Ateneo for still giving him this chance. Other schools would leave a player out to dry after the player loses value to them.

A UAAP stint would have would have given Ronnie career a boost, but the Ateneo education he will get will widen his career options.

insiderinfo
03-10-2006, 05:12 PM
Here are the facts I know:

1. Ronnie Bughao's records with FEU states that he graduated in 1999.
2. Ateneo received documents from San Beda certifying that Bughao graduated in 2000.

When I say "I heard" it doesn't mean that I was only eavesdropping on a conversation I was not privy to. It only means I did not utter those words and cannot, therefore, claim it as my own. Now, whether or not you believe that is not my problem.

Let me just clarify that I am not laying the blame on any particiular school here. Personally, I do not believe that there was malicious intent on anyone's part to put one over the other. But the documents being official school records deserve to be scrutinized. If we simply say it is not an issue anyway since Bughao will not be playing in the UAAP, then we miss the point here. As oca said, there is the presumption of regularity on docs issued between schools. Once verified it becomes binding to all parties. I agree completely. Hence, my concern.

Peace, everyone.

chba_dude
03-10-2006, 05:21 PM
Facts presented are not complete and therefore lead to too much speculation.

If it is an issue because of the irregularities of the documents presented, then in my personal opinion, it is beyond the discussion about basketball. And gameface.ph is a hardcore hoops site.

It's a sensitive issue then to the 3 schools involved (directly or indirectly). Kaya medyo may friction. That some may misinterpret for bashing or something.

My opinion.

oca
03-10-2006, 06:47 PM
Actually, madali lang i-resolve ang issue.

Ask Bughao kung kailan at saan siya nagtapos ng HS. (Madali naman siyang hanapin.)

The answer to the first will resolve the issue outright. I believe Bughao will not lie on this one...dahil -

The answer to the second will eventually validate his answer.

Now, if there's one naughty mind there who insist on asking, " Bakit sa FEU nakalagay 1999, tapos yung galing sa San Beda ay 2000?", eto ang masasabi ko....hindi yan totoo. It's either 1999 OR 2000 for both docs.

I prefer to cast my lot on the integrity of the verification process of documents between learning institutions, than believe an "I heard ..." post in the internet.

oca
03-10-2006, 07:39 PM
Well, guys, at the Eagles' nest, mukhang concede na sila HINDI makakapaglaro si Bughao next UAAP season.

I say we put this to rest.....

pulang leon
03-10-2006, 07:56 PM
I doubt that Ateneo is that dumb to make a simple mistake and not to check for sure when exactly Bughao graduated from high school before investing some money into his scholarship, etc., specially with their uaap athletic scholars that are about to expire...* Now they are saying that Bughao or "somebody" did cheat, I'm sorry, not cheat... but "mistake" for Bughao on his application to Ateneo by putting on his information that he graduated in 2000 when in fact he graduated in 1999.* It only takes the amount of time driving to Bughao's previous high school to check the records themselves with the high school's registrar's office.* The question is.. how far is FEU from Ateneo?* Ummm... 3 hours with traffic?* How long has Bughao been in Ateneo?* More than a year right?* You mean Ateneo's Admission's Office has been staring at Bughao's application that long??!?* Or "somebody (like ateneo themselves)" knew about the discrepancy all along and is just waiting for the right time to put it out in public and escape from putting the school in sure humiliation....* well, good timing indeed...* a few months after the La Salle's incident and a few months before the UAAP starts...* you can never find a better timing indeed...* This is a very interesting scenario.* Hmmmm....* *Deja vu?* Is it really deja vu?* But wasn't Bughao acquired by the Blue Eagles BEFORE the La Salle incident happened?* It means that Ateneo was about to do a "De La Salle" incident but saw La Salle getting caught (first) and are about to face suspension from UAAP, of course, you wouldn't want to do the same "mistake".* Baka sabihin ng iba, gaya-gaya sila... may nauna nang sumikat doon eh.

Now, the problem or the "misunderstanding" was the year Bughao really graduated from high school.* Ateneo supposedly did their audit trail and are pointing their fingers or "nguso" towards San Beda....* although not "blaming" us daw... kuno... but they said it started in San Beda... they said they found out that San Beda gave them a "certified" copy of Bughao's complete transcript.... and they said it says there year 2000...* That transcript should really be studied carefully and the only way to find out for sure its accuracy is to look for Bughao's freshman application to San Beda College and see if Bughao indeed has placed the year 2000 as the year he graduated from high school and not 1999 and if his transcript says that he passed all required classes to graduate high school.* But no one is questioning right now whether Bughao actually graduated from high school, but just the year he graduated from.* So I'm pretty sure he graduated in high school.* Now if we look at which year Bughao has placed in his application, if he did put the year 2000 on his freshman application, then it is Bughao's mistake for putting the wrong year, which I'm sure with no malice because I don't think he was really planning on playing for more than 7 years in the NCAA and transferring to Ateneo to play for the UAAP years ago.* And it would be San Beda's mistake for not verifying it back then when Bughao was a freshman, though I'm sure they verified if he really is a high school graduate, it's not a priority to know which high school batch he really belonged.. 1999 or 2000.*

But if Bughao had put 1999 as his year of high school graduation in his freshman application to San Beda, then I doubt that San Beda's registrar's would change it to year 2000 without a valid reason or if there's no need to change it.* Was San Beda's transcripts authentic?* or baka sa Recto lang galing yan?* If it was changed to year 2000, the only reason that that could happen is for Bughao's transcripts to show the UAAP board that he still has one year left in him, even after serving a one year residency with ateneo's team B.* That means somebody changed it to serve that purpose... pero saan ba dinuktor?* Sa San Beda ba?* But again, why would they change it??* Wala lang?* Yeah right!* For the money??* Perhaps (or Malamang).* Paid by whom?* Alangan naman mga lasalista.* Or sa ateneo na dinuktor??* thinking that the UAAP board will not investigate further...* ateneo is not dealing with the house of representatives here like they think they can get away too like ate glo... they probably thought otherwise when they are seeing their beloved rival on the brink of suspension....* Either way, if this was the case, even if Bughao did not play in the UAAP, there was some manipulating done on the transcripts...* If this was the case, wala nang kailangan aminin....* a person doesn't have to admit or partially admit to what they have done us to know what the truth is....*

It looks like San Beda knew all along how good Bughao is as a basketball player.... and they knew all along Bughao's expiration date in college basketball.... that's probably one of the reasons why they had to let him go....* bakit mo nga naman i-blame ang san beda?* but ateneo took him anyway...* san beda knows he is about to expired....* but it's their game plan and it's a different league.... so San Beda is not supposed to meddle...* but i won't object if there was some investigating done....* the cheaters should be held liable....* i'm not asking EDSA V against ate glo...* *just an investigation...* even those in San Beda's registrar's office....* unless they got recruited too...* san beda has been quiet and i'm sure ateneo will keep quiet on this one too....* they don't have to admit anything and they will not blame anyone... not even themselves of course...* * if it were me, i'd sue the other party for giving me the wrong information that cost me a lot of money to pay for scholarships, etc...* but i'm sure ateneo is not gonna sue san beda or anyone....* the best way to go about it is to keep quiet with what you've "tried" to do to get around the uaap board to win the uaap basketball championship.... lol...* here's a deal...* quit pointing your dirty fingers at us and san beda we'll keep quiet too...* not to hide anything, but just not to meddle...

I wonder if Ateneo will kick Bughao out of school.* I mean if his information on his application is fraudulent, shouldn't Ateneo drop his scholarship right away and kick him out of school?* I don't know about Ateneo but if a player or a student does something fraudulent in their application in San Beda.. they'd be kicked-out.* Even if it were found out that they cheated after graduating from college, their San Beda diplomas will be automatically become void.* Yup, even when we desperately need good players like Bughao 'cause we couldn't even get our own high school players most of the time and even though we haven't won the NCAA Championship in 28 long years...* we'd still kick them out!* and they've been kicked-out!* I'm pretty sure it is the same way in "most" reputable schools.* But if he wasn't the one who put that on there.. why kick him out right?* he will probably confess if you do, and of course...* you don't want that either... lol.... so shhhhh.... better just pull your pointing finger back to your pocket and keep quiet.....* * ;)

atenean_blooded
03-11-2006, 04:47 AM
So, ano'ng problema mo?

Medyo simplistic, pero pwede na ang analysis.

Kung masasabi mo kung bakit may pagkahipokrito, baka sige, may pag-usapan pa tayo.

Kung hindi namin inaamin na nagkamali kami, e di bakit hindi na nga namin paglalaruin si Bughao sa darating na UAAP?

Napakasimple ng sinabi ko. Hindi mo yata na-gets.




Nakuuu! Napakahirap talagang gisingin ang nagtutulog-tulugan. Tatantanan na kita, pare. Nakakahiya na kasi sa karamihan dito na nakakaintindi. Alam kong sasagutin mo pa ito dahil hindi mo kayang tiisin na hindi ikaw ang may huling salita. Pagkatapos mong sumagot, meme ka na ulit nang mahimbing, ha.




Sige. Tama yan. Tantanan mo na kami, at mahiya ka naman sa aming mga nakararami at nakakaintindi.


Now that we've set the stupidity of creating stupid issues where they don't exist aside, and have settled once and for all that Ronnie Bughao is not playing for the Blue Eagles in the UAAP, we can get to an important issue which has been pointed out here: the consistency of Bughao's documents, which may eventually mean something for all of our schools in the future.

This is the key point, as seen in this discussion: Ateneo recruited Bughao from San Beda, and San Beda supplied the Ateneo with Bughao's documents, which said 2000. But before San Beda, Bughao was in FEU. The documents FEU brought to the attention of the Ateneo said Bughao graduated in 1999, not 2000.

Several things have been brought up:

- Why did the documents San Beda transmitted to the Ateneo say 2000, and not 1999?
- Was this particular discrepancy caused by San Beda, Bughao himself, or a third party? Was this cause deliberate, or a mistake?
- Assuming the Ateneo team management and admissions committee cross-checked the validity of Bughao's records with San Beda, did they also cross-check with FEU? Apparently, the records from San Beda were considered sufficient at the time that Bughao was recruited.
- So, how could the changes have come about?

My take on it thus far is that the paper trail ought to be traced, from the Ateneo, to San Beda, to FEU, and most probably to Bughao's high school. The cross-refencing and asking Bughao directly will probably allow us to put the questions to rest.

Mateen Cleaves
03-11-2006, 07:35 AM
My take on it thus far is that the paper trail ought to be traced, from the Ateneo, to San Beda, to FEU, and most probably to Bughao's high school. The cross-refencing and asking Bughao directly will probably allow us to put the questions to rest.


In my research classes, students often cite secondary references -- work by authors/researchers as cited in some other article that the students found. I always encourage them to look for the original article, if it's available. The secondary article most likely does not give the complete picture. Worse, the second author may be wrong in his/her interpretation of the original work.

Here's where Ateneo fell short. They presumed the regularity of the docs transmitted from San Beda. They accepted San Beda's secondary report as to Bughao's high school record. They apparently did not go to the original source -- Bughao's high school. But was it reasonable to expect ordinary admissions officers to recognize the need for this? Probably not. They don't do that for all transfers, i suspect.

The question (for all schools, now) is whether athletic programs have sufficiently oriented registrars/admissions officers about eligibility for competiton. What are the red flags that admissions people should look out for when processing the documents of recruits? Should schools appoint compliance officers, if they haven't yet, just to make sure that their athletes do not suddenly become ineligible because of some tiny, tiny aspect of their credentials?

Nevertheless, as a non-Atenean, the most intriguing question for me is... "Saan nga ba nag-high school si Bughao?" ;D

chba_dude
03-11-2006, 10:56 AM
Anak ng tokwa. Parang ang daming padaplis sa aking paaralan.

From an unidentified yet very reliable source:

FEU and SBC records show that Ronnie graduated high school in 2000. I repeat: No discrepancy between FEU and SBC records. That clears SBC from any allegations of "wrongdoing"...

In case anyone wants to know where Ronnie graduated high school, Avellana National High School in Cebu...

Mang_Roger
03-11-2006, 01:56 PM
Anak ng tokwa. Parang ang daming padaplis sa aking paaralan.

From an unidentified yet very reliable source:

FEU and SBC records show that Ronnie graduated high school in 2000. I repeat: No discrepancy between FEU and SBC records. That clears SBC from any allegations of "wrongdoing"...

In case anyone wants to know where Ronnie graduated high school, Avellana National High School in Cebu...


BULLSEYE!

I, for one, was told by a reliable source that the records transmitted by FEU to SBC and then of SBC to Ateneo states that Ronnie graduated in 2000. There is no discrepancy between two records being alluded to or even misrepresented by others (a.k.a. as boneheads) as if it is a proven fact.

The problem with other posters here is that they try to deflect controversy away from their school by pointing to San Beda as the probable culprit.

Facts, Facts, Facts. You can't argue based on a premise founded on surmises. That's very elementary my dear fellow posters!

easter
03-11-2006, 06:22 PM
FEU and SBC records show that Ronnie graduated high school in 2000. I repeat: No discrepancy between FEU and SBC records. That clears SBC from any allegations of "wrongdoing"...

In case anyone wants to know where Ronnie graduated high school, Avellana National High School in Cebu...


BULLSEYE!

I, for one, was told by a reliable source that the records transmitted by FEU to SBC and then of SBC to Ateneo states that Ronnie graduated in 2000. There is no discrepancy between two records being alluded to or even misrepresented by others (a.k.a. as boneheads) as if it is a proven fact.



??? (kamot...kamot sa ulo) So kung sinabi ng FEU na 2000 at ganun din ang sinabi ng San Beda eh ano ang problema di ba 6 yrs. lang yun? Ano naman ang nakalagay sa records ng Avellana National High School? Ano naman ang sabi ni Bughao? Sila pala ang makakasagot ng maayos nito.

atenean_blooded
03-11-2006, 08:25 PM
"From an unidentified yet very reliable source:

FEU and SBC records show that Ronnie graduated high school in 2000. I repeat: No discrepancy between FEU and SBC records. That clears SBC from any allegations of "wrongdoing"..."


"I, for one, was told by a reliable source that the records transmitted by FEU to SBC and then of SBC to Ateneo states that Ronnie graduated in 2000. There is no discrepancy between two records being alluded to or even misrepresented by others (a.k.a. as boneheads) as if it is a proven fact."


I think easter said it quite well. If there's no discrepancy, the there should be no issue! Ronnie Bughao should be, as per the documents given by San Beda (which should be the same with FEU's), ELIGBLE TO PLAY IN THE UAAP.

But the thing is, we do have an issue at hand, and Bughao, at least as of this writing, isn't playing for the Ateneo.

Also, I think we should note that FEU approached our team management and informed them of the discrepancy. And without pointing fingers, I think it will be safe to say that there is a discrepancy (unless, of course, the "reliable sources" can produce these documents for our benefit).

easter
03-11-2006, 08:57 PM
Again madali lang ito solusyunan. Ask Bughao kailan siya grumadweyt.

Then kapag sinabi niya 1999 eh hindi na talaga siya pwede. Pero ang tanong bat nagkaganun ang records niya (malamang honest mistake lang kasi di naman niya naisip na hanggang ngayon ay naglalaro pa rin siya ng college ball di ba. Di ka naman mangangarap ng ganito katagal sa college.)

Kapag naman sinabi niya na 2000 then i-verify pa din sa Avellana National High School para sigurado. Kapag nagtugma eh di...

Out_Of_The_Blue
03-11-2006, 11:46 PM
Again madali lang ito solusyunan. Ask Bughao kailan siya grumadweyt.

Then kapag sinabi niya 1999 eh hindi na talaga siya pwede. Pero ang tanong bat nagkaganun ang records niya (malamang honest mistake lang kasi di naman niya naisip na hanggang ngayon ay naglalaro pa rin siya ng college ball di ba. Di ka naman mangangarap ng ganito katagal sa college.)

Kapag naman sinabi niya na 2000 then i-verify pa din sa Avellana National High School para sigurado. Kapag nagtugma eh di...



Ronnie said he graduated from high School in 1999. Lets put this to rest.

arhtmahn
03-12-2006, 12:10 AM
THIS JUST IN FROM AN UNIDENTIFIED SOURCE WHO WANTS TO BE RELIABLE:

An official from Avellana National High School points to an assistant coach and a contractual statistician of a highly reputable chain of shool franchises as the culprits behind the falsification of Bughao's graduation date.* This was reportedly in lieu of a pro-forma PEP Test certificate they had earlier offered to fabricate, este... procure, este... acquire.

tambay_sa_recto
03-12-2006, 02:37 AM
Anak ng tokwa. Parang ang daming padaplis sa aking paaralan.






The problem with other posters here is that they try to deflect controversy away from their school by pointing to San Beda as the probable culprit.



HOY GISIIIIING!!!

Pasensiya na chba_dude at Mang_Roger, ang hirap talagang gisingin, eh. Sabihan ba naman tayo na HINDI NA NGA NAMIN PAGLALARUIN SA UAAP, EH ANO PA ANG GUSTO N'YO? Dadagdagan pa ng paratang na may anomalya sa pagpasa-pasa ng dokumento, sabay tingin sa direksiyon ng U-Belt. Ang tindeeeh talaga!

Mga Atenista, ang alam ng SBC, FEU at pati na rin ninyo ay nagtapos siya ng 2000 noong lumipat siya sa inyo kaya't inasahan n'yo na pwede pa siyang maglaro sa UAAP. Ngayong lumalabas na 1999 pala siya nagtapos ayon sa FEU, kahit na anong gusto pa ninyong paglaruin siya, hindi na pwede. Huwag ninyong ipangalandakan na tama ang ginagawa ninyo dahil wala naman na kayong iba pang pwedeng gawin. Magpapasalamat pa ba kami sa inyo na hindi ninyo sinibukang palusutin 'yan? At maawa naman kayo sa SBC na nagrekomenda sa kanya na walang malisya at sa FEU na tumimbre nang kusa sa inyo. Hanga ako sa inyo na hindi n'yo siya bibitawan pero dapat intindihin ninyo na walang may utang sa inyong paliwanag kung bakit nagyari ito. Lahat tayo pare-pareho lang ang tinatanong.

cackler
03-12-2006, 09:49 AM
Interesting discussion.

Go on . . . I think we are nearing the truth . . .

Lessen the bashing and we are closer to the truth.

Do the time line, check sources, establish facts:

1999 (March) Ronnie graduates from Avellana (according to . . . .)
1999 (Summer) Ang galing ng batang ito . . . kunin natin sa koponan natin ( according to . . .)
. . . mas maganda kung hanggang _____ ay makakapaglaro sa atin . . . pahiniguin natin ng husto . . .
. . . katulad ng ginagawa natin sa iba nating palyers (according to . . . )
. . . eh di palabasin natin na 2000 siya graduate (according to . . . )
2000 Naglalaro na para sa ____ . . . nagpapahinog
2001 Naglalaro na para sa ____ . . . galing . . . lipat ng dokumento
2002 Naglalaro na para sa ____ . . . ang galing talaga
2003 Galing talaga . . . lipat ng dokumento
2004 Super galing
2005 Naglalaro na para sa Ateneo
. . . Yari, bukingan sa PEP Test
. . . iskandalong malaki
. . . iimbestigahan lahat
2006 Yari sila . . . may pamalit na tayo kay Tenorio
. . . "Pare, yung player na napunta sa inyo, may sabit ang dokumento noon . . .
pag hinalungkat . . . sa amin nangyari ang kalokohan . . .
huwag niyo nang palaruin sa UAAP kasi pag submit ng papeles niyan . . . iskandalo pihado
please lang . . . huwag niyo nang isubmit ang papeles para di na mahalungkat." (according to . . .)
. . . hoy gising mga taga gameface

So you see, FEU documents showed 2000 then Beda documents showed 2000.

Si Ronnie ba gumagawa ng mga transfer documents? When they got him, did they not tell him they will take care of all the documents for enrollment, etc.?

Hindi ba si Ronnie na rin mismo, when he heard about the 7 year rule of UAAP, ang nagsabi na "may problema ako?"

Magaling si Ronnie. Medyo sensitive at emotional. Madaling mamis interpret . . . pero tapat pag kinausap ng tapat.

oca
03-12-2006, 11:33 AM
Set aside the names involve, both player and schools-

HOW MANY AMONG US HARDCORE ARE ACTUALLY AWARE OF THIS "7 YEAR OUT OF HS" RULE ?

Sa dami ng eligibility issues na pumutok na, kailan pa ito unang nabanggit?

The player has spent almost 1 full academic year at his present school before anyone noticed.

Ano ibig sabihin....

This is a simple case of the parties- the player and school - not aware of this particular provision in their league's eligibility rules.

Lesson learned -

PAG-ARALAN NG MASUSI ANG ELIGIBILITY RULES NG INYONG LIGA.

Itigil na itong mga pasaring ng lokohan o lusutan. Humaba na ang usapan at naging personalan na tila.

This is a hardcore hoops forum. Kung di niyo matiis na i-focus o limitahan ang usapin dyan...punta kayo sa PEX.

oca
03-12-2006, 11:43 AM
Tapusin na ang usapan.

Sabi ng mga taga-Ateneo rito, HINDI makakalaro si Bughao next UAAP seaon.

Indirectly, Bughao trying-out for PBL team TELETECH "re-confirms" he is ineligible.

Bughao did played for Ateneo, but in off-season events, where this eligibility provision is a non-issue.

No rules were violated.

Ano pa ang issue?

cackler
03-12-2006, 12:25 PM
Pareng OCA:

I can see your point. But I am in a quandary now.

An hour after my post, somebody texted me clarifying what happened in their end and stating their version of part of the truth. This person was denying any hanky panky from their side. Hmmm.

I was about to repost my earlier post and type additional verified facts . . .

I was hoping an intelligent discussion in this forum can bring out the truth. After that, the lessons learned surface. Then, we will get to discussing the values that will help refine and define what it means to compete with integrity.

Pero mukhang may masasaktan.

So I will leave it at that . . . maybe bahala na si batman.

Thanks for your inputs.

oca
03-12-2006, 12:49 PM
Okay cackler,

"...bring out the truth.", part of your post would say.

What truth?

Truth as to what were stated in the documents?* That it is 1999 sa FEU, 2000 naman sa San Beda?

Or, bakit 2000 ang nakalagay for both FEU and San Beda pero 1999 naman pala ang totong year na nagtapos si Bughao?

Well, the truth can only be arrived at if both documents can be produced HERE IN THIS FORUM. Documents issued by both FEU and San Beda. Can that happen here? I doubt.

Until those docs are presented to this forum, it will just be "I heard...", and* "I was told..."

Tulad na lang ng sinulat mo "An hour after my post, somebody texted me clarifying what happened in their end and stating their version of part of the truth.* This person was denying any hanky panky from their side. "

Ano yung version na yun?

Can you actually share it with us?

Part of "their truth"? How can an official document issued by one school be part truth.... and... what... part false?

Hindi matatapos ang usapan...at wala naman patutunguhan.

To me here, unless it is someone of authority from Ateneo who issues an official statement giving us the details, then no discussion is worth pursuing.

Mateen Cleaves
03-12-2006, 01:52 PM
Set aside the names involve, both player and schools-

HOW MANY AMONG US HARDCORE ARE ACTUALLY AWARE OF THIS "7 YEAR OUT OF HS" RULE ?

Sa dami ng eligibility issues na pumutok na, kailan pa ito unang nabanggit?


I find it hard to believe that nobody from Ateneo was aware of this rule. Hindi ba ito ang rason kung bakit hindi nakapaglaro si Chad Alonzo sa Adamson? Hindi ba last year lang 'yon? Last year din, one or some other school raised the same issue against Axel Doruelo. UP provided documentary evidence to support Axel's eligibility and that was that.

With somebody like Bughao -- maga-apat na kolehiyo na (hindi ba transfer din siya sa FEU?) -- coming in, hindi ba dapat inusisa agad yon?

chocoks77
03-12-2006, 05:55 PM
I'm with InsiderInfo on this one. As someone who wants to see Ronnie Bughao kick ass in the UAAP I would dearly love to find out once and for all what his records actually said, 1999 or 2000? Frankly I think at least 95% of the blame for this whole mess should be laid directly at the feet of Ateneo team management. Regardless of how good a player is his papers should be thoroughly scrutinized. For godsakes, what good is a player to the school if he isn't even eligible to play in the first place? I used to work as a school registrar for a small Nursing school and transfer students in particular were always submitted to thorough scrutiny, because we had to make certain we weren't going to wind up harboring some miscreant.

That this should happen to Ateneo of all schools is disgraceful! I'm not about to be a hypocrite about it: the primary - if not the only - reason Blue is in Ateneo is because we want him to play in the UAAP. He made it through the entrance process, but I wonder about the admissions process. Because part of the admissions process would be the verification of his papers. A discrepancy in high school graduation would raise minor alarms (clerical error / honest mistake) or major alarms (falsification of a school document, punishable under special laws and other applicable statutes).

This is why I want to know the whole story - and why I am taking this stand. If Blue can no longer play in the UAAP it would be a tremendous loss for Ateneo, but its not going to be the end of Ateneo Basketball.

So lets go back to the original question that will settle all of this: WHEN DID RONNIE BUGHAO GRADUATE FROM HIGH SCHOOL, 1999 OR 2000?* *


Pare tatanong ko lang sa kaklase ko sa IS na si Paolo Trillo kapag nagkita kami. Siya ba ang tinutukoy mo dito? Hmmm! Bakit nga naman hindi inusisa ng ayos ang papeles nito. Ano ba 'to purong basketball na lang ang usapan? Isusunod ba tayo ni Paolo sa La Salle? There are many covered courts boys that could play better ball than some of the team malamang mas magaling pa kay Quimson na kinasusuklaman mo, Mr. Scoundrel, ngunit bakit lagi na lang umaasa sa labas. Dyan tayo madadale lalo na kung ganyan ang style ng Ateneo Basketball Team Management natin.

green_minded
03-12-2006, 06:24 PM
No wonder di umuunlad ang Pinas. Simpleng graduation year lang di pa malaman natin hehehe. :P

admu_addict
03-12-2006, 10:58 PM
Set aside the names involve, both player and schools-

HOW MANY AMONG US HARDCORE ARE ACTUALLY AWARE OF THIS "7 YEAR OUT OF HS" RULE ?

Sa dami ng eligibility issues na pumutok na, kailan pa ito unang nabanggit?


I find it hard to believe that nobody from Ateneo was aware of this rule. Hindi ba ito ang rason kung bakit hindi nakapaglaro si Chad Alonzo sa Adamson? Hindi ba last year lang 'yon? Last year din, one or some other school raised the same issue against Axel Doruelo. UP provided documentary evidence to support Axel's eligibility and that was that.

With somebody like Bughao -- maga-apat na kolehiyo na (hindi ba transfer din siya sa FEU?) -- coming in, hindi ba dapat inusisa agad yon?







I think it was Ronnie who wasn't aware of the rule.

i agree with oca. ano pa nga ba ang issue? malamang marami dito gusto lang "makaganti" at gusto pang "mandamay".

chief
03-13-2006, 09:25 AM
I think tapos na ang usapan. Tutal si Ronnie ay hindi na makakapaglaro sa Ateneo, and he is fully aware of it. The fact is hindi na siya palalaruin ng Ateneo sa coming UAAP season. So I think case is closed, wala naman na-violate ang Ateneo na rule. Muntikan nga lang, pero in totality wala naman.

Ngayon, si Ronnie hanggang minor leagues na lamang, hanggang doon na lang siya. Kung sinoman ang nagkamali, kung sadya ay tubuan ka nang maraming pigsa sa mukha... kung hindi man sadya, wag na sanang maulit ang pagkakamali.... pero sino naman ang aamin na sinadya nila ang nangyari?

MargaretThrasher
03-13-2006, 01:14 PM
No, actually, I think there's one little part of the issue that hasn't been and, unlike the issue of the erroneous papers, can be cleared up with some investigation.

Ano ba talaga yang "seven-year rule" na yan? Can someone please get the correct interpretation of this rule? It seems to me that the Ateneo immediately reacted to the dirty words "seven years out of high school" without bothering to check whether or not pasok pa si Ronnie.

sometimes salvatio
03-13-2006, 02:44 PM
Sayang naman kung ganun.

By the way, you guys said there were four colleges in ronnie's life during this seven-year-itch, SBC, FEU, ADMU, and?

atenista_comm
03-13-2006, 07:22 PM
Sayang naman kung ganun.

By the way, you guys said there were four colleges in ronnie's life during this seven-year-itch, SBC, FEU, ADMU, and?


In 1999, Ronnie Bughao studied in the University of the Visayas.* In 2000, he took residency at FEU.

oca
03-14-2006, 08:40 AM
No, actually, I think there's one little part of the issue that hasn't been and, unlike the issue of the erroneous papers, can be cleared up with some investigation.

Ano ba talaga yang "seven-year rule" na yan? Can someone please get the correct interpretation of this rule? It seems to me that the Ateneo immediately reacted to the dirty words "seven years out of high school" without bothering to check whether or not pasok pa si Ronnie.


Sa pagkakaintindi ko, it means-

From the time a kid graduates from highschool,thereafter, he has a seven year period in which he may play in the UAAP. This is in ADDITION to other eligibility rules enforced in the league.

Just like the "5-playing years rule", this rule supercedes the "age cut off rule of 25 years old". Because if you finished HS at 16, it means you can play only until age 23.

Sa dami ng mga batang nagsimula mag grade one at age 6, we have a generation of kids who will be covered by this rule.

I hope someone here can state with certainty how long this provision has been in the rule book.

Obviously, Bughao was not aware of this rule. Otherwise he would have stayed at San Beda, or if he was so adamant to leave, not transfer to a UAAP member school.

If we just took time to know of Bughao's college saga....from UV...FEU...San Beda..and Ateneo, it is clear... very clear that this rule has served it's purpose - that is : No to student mercenaries.

Dahil kung student-athlete ka, aral muna at segunda lang ang bola. But if a kid is in "perpetual search of basketball glory" this rule, among others, will not accomodate your ambitions at the UAAP.

coretoxic
03-14-2006, 11:47 AM
Hi. I'm new here.

Di po ako tambay. I just read Bill Velasco's article in the Star this morning, and I took a peek at your website. And I must say, this has been a quite an experience. Kudos and more power.

I noticed though, that the Bughao issue is white hot in your forums. Just wanted to contribute my two cents worth.

From what I've gathered, Bughao has been disallowed by Ateneo to play in UAAP 2006, not because of an anomaly in his papers, but because he has exceeded the "7-years-out-of-HS".

But is there an anomaly in his papers? Apparently there is. He graduated in 1999, but his FEU and SBC papers show he graduated in 2000. Two things come to mind:

1. FEU and SBC did not verify the authenticity of Bughao's credentials, or at least, did not do a thorough enough job. If one argues that they did, then one must concede that ADMU did a better job about it, since ADMU ang nakakita sa anomalya.

2. AMDU did. Whether by investigation or dumb luck, it was Ateneo that brought forth the said anomaly. Not SBC.

Was there a need for SBC (and FEU for that matter) to verify Bughao's credentials? Of course. Not just because of the "7-year-rule", becuase such a rule does not exist in the NCAA. But probably because it is the responsibility of each school to confirm the veracity of all documents of all students who submit any kind of application, athlete or otherwise. As someone else pointed out, NU was thorough enough to weed out Cardona. I don't need to stand around in Recto to figure that out.

chba_dude
03-14-2006, 12:12 PM
"From an unidentified yet very reliable source:

FEU and SBC records show that Ronnie graduated high school in 2000. I repeat: No discrepancy between FEU and SBC records. That clears SBC from any allegations of "wrongdoing"..."

Also, I think we should note that FEU approached our team management and informed them of the discrepancy. And without pointing fingers, I think it will be safe to say that there is a discrepancy (unless, of course, the "reliable sources" can produce these documents for our benefit).


I won't say how but I saw a copy of Ronnie's FEU records with my very own eyes. Acquired from FEU, Signed by Registrar. Expressly stating Ronnie graduating HS in 2000.

If anyone insists that SBC is a part of this, I don't believe we have enough clout to make FEU keep records stating that Bughao graduated HS in 2000, Elem in 1996.

Btw, i correct myself. It is Abellana not Avellana.

chipanggo
03-14-2006, 12:45 PM
I believe it's time to lay this issue to rest. We all know now that Ronnie will not be part of Ateneo's UAAP lineup due to his ineligibility. Did Ateneo break any rules? Nope.

Sayang sana yung contribution ni Ronnie if he was just eligible to play. All I can say now is thank you to Ronnie for all the help he has given to the team. As for his future, I wish him all the best whether he pursues his studies at the Ateneo or his basketball career in the PBL and the PBA eventually.

Although he will not be able to play for Ateneo in the UAAP, in my book, Ronnie is a true Blue Eagle.

LION
03-14-2006, 03:17 PM
Hi. I'm new here.

Di po ako tambay. I just read Bill Velasco's article in the Star this morning, and I took a peek at your website. And I must say, this has been a quite an experience. Kudos and more power.

I noticed though, that the Bughao issue is white hot in your forums. Just wanted to contribute my two cents worth.

From what I've gathered, Bughao has been disallowed by Ateneo to play in UAAP 2006, not because of an anomaly in his papers, but because he has exceeded the "7-years-out-of-HS".

But is there an anomaly in his papers? Apparently there is. He graduated in 1999, but his FEU and SBC papers show he graduated in 2000. Two things come to mind:

1. FEU and SBC did not verify the authenticity of Bughao's credentials, or at least, did not do a thorough enough job. If one argues that they did, then one must concede that ADMU did a better job about it, since ADMU ang nakakita sa anomalya.

2. AMDU did. Whether by investigation or dumb luck, it was Ateneo that brought forth the said anomaly. Not SBC.

Was there a need for SBC (and FEU for that matter) to verify Bughao's credentials? Of course. Not just because of the "7-year-rule", becuase such a rule does not exist in the NCAA. But probably because it is the responsibility of each school to confirm the veracity of all documents of all students who submit any kind of application, athlete or otherwise. As someone else pointed out, NU was thorough enough to weed out Cardona. I don't need to stand around in Recto to figure that out.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------*

Coretoxic,

Your post maliciously imputes negligence on the part of SBC.* Note that since Bughao was a transfer student from FEU, SBC should only verify* the authenticity of the FEU records/credentials of Bughao.* His college (FEU) records were found to be in order hence, SBC admitted Bughao as a transfer student.* Obviously, SBC need not* check the high school records of Bughao because he was already a college student at the time he applied with SBC.* SBC relied on the presumption that FEU did check and verify his high school credentials because he was already admitted by FEU as a college student.

ADMU did a better job in verifying Bughao's high school records? I don't think so. Judging from the account's of the posters here, Bughao's ineligibility was only discovered by accident, and not because of ADMU's efforts to verify Bughao's high school records.

I can understand your desire to protect your school, the Ateneo, from this mess.* However, please do it the gentleman's way.* It should not be done at the expense of my school which, for all intents and purposes, is also just a victim like ADMU.

Peace!

tambay_sa_recto
03-14-2006, 08:19 PM
Hi. I'm new here.

Di po ako tambay...

Bughao has been disallowed by Ateneo to play in UAAP 2006...

one must concede that ADMU did a better job about it, since ADMU ang nakakita sa anomalya...

it was Ateneo that brought forth the said anomaly...

I don't need to stand around in Recto to figure that out.




Alam mo, bagito, ang payo ko sa iyo ay basahin mong muli itong thread na ito mula sa umpisa. Bagalan mo para maintindihan mong mabuti. Hindi kayo ang nag-"disallow" kay Bughao maglaro. Sa ayaw at sa gusto ninyo HINDI SIYA PWEDENG MAGLARO. Kuha mo ang pagkakaiba? Hindi kayo ang nakakita ng anomalya at hindi rin kayo ang nagbunyag. Naglabas na ba kayo ng official statement tungkol sa bagay na ito? Hindi. Mistulang mga pipe at bingi ang mga school at team officials ninyo. Umaasa lang sila sa mga katulad mong panatikong hungkag na ipagtanggol ang kanilang malaking pagkakamali sa mga usapang katulad nito. Subukan mo, amang, na tumambay sa Recto. Hamak na marumi't maingay kaysa sa kinasanayan mo pero mas marami kang matututunan tungkol sa tootong buhay dito.

coretoxic
03-14-2006, 10:28 PM
Bagito. That's cute, I like that.

To accuse ADMU of negligence, yet conveniently proclaim FEU and SBC completely innocent, is quite a shame, really. A previous poster justifies SBC by saying that the college need only verify the authenticity of the FEU records/credentials of Bughao. But did SBC really do that? If so, if SBC really scrutinized his papers, then why did they not catch the anomaly? Why the accidental discovery only now, when it could have been discovered years ago by SBC? Because there was no need to check on the HS records, only the college records? That's so convenient. There must be hundreds of pages of school guidlelines to support that.

***

SBC: nakuha ang records mula sa FEU, mukhang OK naman, papasukin natin sa SBC at paglaruin. SBC INNOCENT

ADMU: nakuha ang records mula sa SBC, mukhang ok naman, papasukin natin sa ADMU at paglaruin. ADMU GUILTY?

ADMU: Teka, sabi ng taga FEU (na taga ADMU din naman), mukhang mali ang records galing FEU at SBC, magkaiba ang HS graduation date at HS graduation papers. Di napansin yun ng FEU at ng SBC, pero di na bale. Huwag pa rin natin paglaruin. ADMU GUILTY?

Hindi pala ADMU ang nag-disallow kay Bughao naglaro. E sino ang nag-disallow sa kanya? Yung UAAP board? Ni hindi pa nga nagsisimula ang UAAP 2006. Ni hindi pa nagsubmit ng mga lineups. Konting common sense naman.

shyboy
03-14-2006, 11:17 PM
I won't say how but I saw a copy of Ronnie's FEU records with my very own eyes. Acquired from FEU, Signed by Registrar. Expressly stating Ronnie graduating HS in 2000.

If anyone insists that SBC is a part of this, I don't believe we have enough clout to make FEU keep records stating that Bughao graduated HS in 2000, Elem in 1996.

Btw, i correct myself. It is Abellana not Avellana.

Hmmm, having one erroneous entry like the HS graduation year can be forgivable. But having two entries, both the HS and Elem graduation years, as erroneous makes one wonder. And how/why the hell did Mark Molina get hold of Bughao's records again when Ronnie's been out of FEU for at least 4 years now?

Mateen Cleaves
03-15-2006, 12:43 AM
Was there a need for SBC (and FEU for that matter) to verify Bughao's credentials? Of course. Not just because of the "7-year-rule", becuase such a rule does not exist in the NCAA. But probably because it is the responsibility of each school to confirm the veracity of all documents of all students who submit any kind of application, athlete or otherwise. As someone else pointed out, NU was thorough enough to weed out Cardona. I don't need to stand around in Recto to figure that out.


There are two kinds of eligibility here. The first is academic eligibility. For transfer students, most universities do not ask for the high school records/diplomas/transcripts. The more relevant documents are the transfer documents from the previous university -- which include the players grades, as well as the notes about previous academic work (including high school graduated from). The schools -- FEU, SBC, and ADMU -- all gave Bughao a clean bill of health on this score. Why would they doubt the certification from the registrars of UV, FEU, and SBC, respectively? Besides, IF there is a discrepancy as to Bughao's graduation year... how would that affect his ability to handle the course work at FEU, San Beda, or Ateneo? Nobody is disputing the fact that Bughao is a high school graduate. Thus, an error on his graduation year (typo or otherwise) is immaterial to the question of whether he could hack the course work at the three schools.

However, athletic eligibility is a different matter entirely. This is the responsibility of the respective basketball programs. At FEU, Bughao was still eligible for the UAAP. Similarly, San Beda made sure that Bughao was eligible for the NCAAs. In your own apples-to-oranges example, NU's main reason for refusing Cardona was because they had doubts that he would be eligible as a Fil-Am transferee. Not because they had doubts on his academic credentials.

The responsibility for making sure that Bughao would be eligible for UAAP Season 69 was solely Ateneo's. Ateneo didn't do its job. Fortunately for Ateneo, FEU did theirs. Thus, ADMU cannot point its finger at anybody except itself. That's why people are so riled up. Maybe you should take up tambay's invitation to visit Recto... because, clearly, you have NOT figured it out yet.

LION
03-15-2006, 09:32 AM
Bagito. That's cute, I like that.

To accuse ADMU of negligence, yet conveniently proclaim FEU and SBC completely innocent, is quite a shame, really. A previous poster justifies SBC by saying that the college need only verify* the authenticity of the FEU records/credentials of Bughao. But did SBC really do that? If so, if SBC really scrutinized his papers, then why did they not catch the anomaly? Why the accidental discovery only now, when it could have been discovered years ago by SBC? Because there was no need to check on the HS records, only the college records? That's so convenient. There must be hundreds of pages of school guidlelines to support that.

***

SBC: nakuha ang records mula sa FEU, mukhang OK naman, papasukin natin sa SBC at paglaruin. SBC INNOCENT

ADMU: nakuha ang records mula sa SBC, mukhang ok naman, papasukin natin sa ADMU at paglaruin. ADMU GUILTY?

ADMU: Teka, sabi ng taga FEU (na taga ADMU din naman), mukhang mali ang records galing FEU at SBC, magkaiba ang HS graduation date at HS graduation papers. Di napansin yun ng FEU at ng SBC, pero di na bale. Huwag pa rin natin paglaruin. ADMU GUILTY?

Hindi pala ADMU ang nag-disallow kay Bughao naglaro. E sino ang nag-disallow sa kanya? Yung UAAP board? Ni hindi pa nga nagsisimula ang UAAP 2006. Ni hindi pa nagsubmit ng mga lineups. Konting common sense naman.

__________________________________________________ _

Mukhang hindi ka nga talaga nagbabasa ng mabuti bago ka magsulat ng opinion mo. Medyo magta tagalog na ako para mas madali mong maintindihan.

Una, sino ba ang nag aakusa sa ADMU ng negligence? Sino ba ang nagsabi na ang ADMU e guilty? Wala naman. Wala naman ako sinabi na ganun. In fact ang sabi ko sa post ko, kung nagbasa kang mabuti, e parehong biktima and paaralan natin. Nabasa mo ba yun? O hirit ka na lang ng hirit?

Kung babasahin mo ang post mo kahapon, e ikaw ang nag aakusa sa FEU at SBC ng negligence at pinapogi mo ang iyong paaralan na kesyo kayo ang naka diskubre at kayo ang naglahad ng problema.

Kung babasahin mong mabuti yung sagot ko kahapon, ang sinabi ko lang e walang negligence on the part of SBC. Hindi nag apply si Bughao straight from High School. Nag apply siya as a college transfer student from FEU. Sa ganyang sitwasyon, ang titingnan lang ng SBC ay ang kanyang college credentials. Hindi na titingnan and authenticity ng kanyang HS credentials (otherwise, sana pati elementary records na rin e binusisi). Ganun din ang ginawa ng ADMU nung lumipat si Bughao from SBC. Ang tiningnan lang ng ADMU ay ang college credentials ni Bughao from FEU and SBC. Kaya nga wala ring effort ang ADMU, tulad ng SBC, na iverify pa yung HS credentials ni Bughao. Siguro, lessons learned, e dapat talaga iverify na rin lahat pati elementary records.)

Ang point dito is, sinisisi mo ang SBC dahil college credentials lang ang kanilang tiningnan nung lumipat si Bughao from FEU at hindi na ang HS credentials. Hindi mo ba alam na ganun din naman ang ginawa ng ADMU? Kaya nga hindi ang ADMU admissions, management, academe o team officials ang naka diskubre. Kung ang ADMU e pwedeng mag rely lang sa college credentials ni Bughao, bakit and SBC hindi?

Dapat maging consistent ka sa aplikasyon ng mga alituntunin mo.

Sabi ko nga. Naintindihan ko na gusto mong maka iwas ang iyong paaralan sa "incident" na ito. Pero may maganda at malinis na paraan diyan. There is no honor in pointing fingers just to get your school out of this mess. Kung ganyan ang gagawin mo e wala na rin kayong pinagiba sa mga taga taft dahil ganun ang ginagawa nila sa inyo.

Ngayon, bago ka sumagot ulit e sana magbasa ka muna ng mabuti.

chba_dude
03-15-2006, 01:14 PM
I really don't know what's the point in arguing. Bughao will not play for Ateneo because he is ineligible. Minus the potentially fraudulent documents, he was eligible to play for FEU (the first time around) and for SBC. For Ateneo, he wasn't. No harm done.

Pointing fingers now will not help anybody. Especially Ronnie. Let him live through this situation. He has the potential to play pro ball. Plus he potentially gets an Ateneo education. A win-win situation.

Ang sa akin lang naman ay protektahan ang aking paaralan. Ang documento galing sa FEU ay nagsasaad na grumadweyt siya noong 2000. Nakalagay din doon ang taon ng pagtatapos ng elementarya noong 1996. Sabi nga ng iba, college transfer credentials lang naman ang hinihingi ng isang paaralang lilipatan sa kolehiyo din. Na naging basehan ng San Beda at Ateneo sa pagtanggap kay Ronnie. Sa ganung sitwasyon, ang 2 paaralan ay inosente. Sa usaping hindi pag tingin ng credibilidad ng papeles ni Ronnie, parehong nagkasala. Bagamat magkaiba ang lebel ng pagkasala, parehong nagkasala.

Pointing fingers breeds more bashing. Wag ganun. Sa ibang forums na lang yan gawin.

MonL
03-15-2006, 01:27 PM
I really don't know what's the point in arguing. Bughao will not play for Ateneo because he is ineligible. Minus the potentially fraudulent documents, he was eligible to play for FEU (the first time around) and for SBC. For Ateneo, he wasn't. No harm done.

Pointing fingers now will not help anybody. Especially Ronnie. Let him live through this situation. He has the potential to play pro ball. Plus he potentially gets an Ateneo education. A win-win situation.

Ang sa akin lang naman ay protektahan ang aking paaralan. Ang documento galing sa FEU ay nagsasaad na grumadweyt siya noong 2000. Nakalagay din doon ang taon ng pagtatapos ng elementarya noong 1996. Sabi nga ng iba, college transfer credentials lang naman ang hinihingi ng isang paaralang lilipatan sa kolehiyo din. Na naging basehan ng San Beda at Ateneo sa pagtanggap kay Ronnie. Sa ganung sitwasyon, ang 2 paaralan ay inosente. Sa usaping hindi pag tingin ng credibilidad ng papeles ni Ronnie, parehong nagkasala. Bagamat magkaiba ang lebel ng pagkasala, parehong nagkasala.

Pointing fingers breeds more bashing. Wag ganun. Sa ibang forums na lang yan gawin.


If I want trash, bash and dimwitted, inane logic, I'll just look at the NCAA forums. What a sorry site, inspite of a small number of good people from all sides which hung around to TRY to make a civil forum out of it.....*

LION
03-15-2006, 01:53 PM
I really don't know what's the point in arguing. Bughao will not play for Ateneo because he is ineligible. Minus the potentially fraudulent documents, he was eligible to play for FEU (the first time around) and for SBC. For Ateneo, he wasn't. No harm done.

Pointing fingers now will not help anybody. Especially Ronnie. Let him live through this situation. He has the potential to play pro ball. Plus he potentially gets an Ateneo education. A win-win situation.

Ang sa akin lang naman ay protektahan ang aking paaralan. Ang documento galing sa FEU ay nagsasaad na grumadweyt siya noong 2000. Nakalagay din doon ang taon ng pagtatapos ng elementarya noong 1996. Sabi nga ng iba, college transfer credentials lang naman ang hinihingi ng isang paaralang lilipatan sa kolehiyo din. Na naging basehan ng San Beda at Ateneo sa pagtanggap kay Ronnie. Sa ganung sitwasyon, ang 2 paaralan ay inosente. Sa usaping hindi pag tingin ng credibilidad ng papeles ni Ronnie, parehong nagkasala. Bagamat magkaiba ang lebel ng pagkasala, parehong nagkasala.

Pointing fingers breeds more bashing. Wag ganun. Sa ibang forums na lang yan gawin.

----------------------------------------------------------

Precisely my point pare.

Wala naman sanang problema kahit ineligible si Bughao. No harm done. Walang rules na na violate ang ADMU. Parehong SBC at ADMU ang nakatangap ng iisang HS record. Parehong biktima or parehong may kasalanan, depende na lang kung paano mo titingnan. Kaso may isang ADMU poster na pina gwapo ang kanyang mahal din na paaralan sa pamamagitan ng pagsira ng ating paaralan.

Respect begets respect, ika nga.

Nandito na rin lang tayo, nais ko ring paalalahanan ang iba nating kapwa Bedista na respetuhin din natin ang mga taga ibang paaralan. Hindi rin maganda na gayahin natin ang mga taga taft na gumagamit ng salitang "Taeneo" o iba pang hindi magandang pananalita. Mali yan. Hindi tama. Hindi gawaing bedista yan. Sana wag na ninyong ulitin. Sa mga taga ADMU, humihingi ako ng paumanhin sa insidenteng yan.

Now, kung papayag si Coretoxic, let us move on. Peace!

Peace!!!

MonL
03-15-2006, 03:13 PM
I really don't know what's the point in arguing. Bughao will not play for Ateneo because he is ineligible. Minus the potentially fraudulent documents, he was eligible to play for FEU (the first time around) and for SBC. For Ateneo, he wasn't. No harm done.

Pointing fingers now will not help anybody. Especially Ronnie. Let him live through this situation. He has the potential to play pro ball. Plus he potentially gets an Ateneo education. A win-win situation.

Ang sa akin lang naman ay protektahan ang aking paaralan. Ang documento galing sa FEU ay nagsasaad na grumadweyt siya noong 2000. Nakalagay din doon ang taon ng pagtatapos ng elementarya noong 1996. Sabi nga ng iba, college transfer credentials lang naman ang hinihingi ng isang paaralang lilipatan sa kolehiyo din. Na naging basehan ng San Beda at Ateneo sa pagtanggap kay Ronnie. Sa ganung sitwasyon, ang 2 paaralan ay inosente. Sa usaping hindi pag tingin ng credibilidad ng papeles ni Ronnie, parehong nagkasala. Bagamat magkaiba ang lebel ng pagkasala, parehong nagkasala.

Pointing fingers breeds more bashing. Wag ganun. Sa ibang forums na lang yan gawin.

----------------------------------------------------------

Precisely my point pare.

Wala naman sanang problema kahit ineligible si Bughao. No harm done. Walang rules na na violate ang ADMU. Parehong SBC at ADMU ang nakatangap ng iisang HS record. Parehong biktima or parehong may kasalanan, depende na lang kung paano mo titingnan. Kaso may isang ADMU poster na pina gwapo ang kanyang mahal din na paaralan sa pamamagitan ng pagsira ng ating paaralan.

Respect begets respect, ika nga.*

Nandito na rin lang tayo, nais ko ring paalalahanan ang iba nating kapwa Bedista na respetuhin din natin ang mga taga* ibang paaralan. Hindi rin maganda na gayahin natin ang mga taga taft na gumagamit ng salitang "Taeneo" o iba pang hindi magandang pananalita.* Mali yan. Hindi tama. Hindi gawaing bedista yan. Sana wag na ninyong ulitin.* Sa mga taga ADMU, humihingi ako ng paumanhin sa insidenteng yan.

Now, kung papayag si Coretoxic, let us move on. Peace!

Peace!!!




Still, for the love of the game, I would like to see Ronnie Bughao play, if only to make for a more competitve game. It would be a great satisfaction to win against your best team, and at the same time, there is no shame in losing if you did your best and the other side did its best as well....

tambay_sa_recto
03-16-2006, 05:36 PM
That's cute…
accuse ADMU of negligence…
proclaim FEU and SBC completely innocent…
why did they not catch the anomaly?…
That's so convenient…
records mula sa FEU, mukhang OK naman… SBC INNOCENT…
nakuha ang records mula sa SBC… ADMU GUILTY?…
mukhang mali ang records… Huwag pa rin natin paglaruin. ADMU GUILTY?
sino ang nag-disallow sa kanya? Yung UAAP board?…
Konting common sense naman.



Pare, wala nang mas cu-cute pa sa iyo, nagpipiring pa nang mata bago humiga't magtulug-tulugan.

Huling sagot ko na sa iyo ito dahil natutunan ko na sa mga kauri mo na hindi ka papayag na hindi ikaw ang may huling salita.

Pansin mo na kaya umaalma ang mga Bedista at ibang walang common sense dito ay dahil gusto ninyong palabasin na nabiktima kayo? Pasalamat kayo at walang pang sariling sub-forum ang mga taga-FEU rito (bakit nga ba?) kundi kuyog kayo sa kagustuhan ninyong manisi ng iba sa paniwalang may luminlang sa inyo. Pwede tayong magdakdakan dito nang walang sawa pero hanggang may magpaskil ng mga tunay na dokumento ni Bughao sa mga pahinang ito, hindi matatapos ang paborito ninyong larong batuhan ng GUILTY at NOT GUILTY.

O, heto.

Bumili si Pedro sa tindahan ng tinapay at ang nakasulat na expiry date ay Linggo. Pagdating niya sa bahay, itinabi niya ang tinapay dahil balak niyang sa Sabado na niya kakainin. Lumipas ang ilang araw. Kinaumagahan ng Sabado, nakita niyang inaamag na ang tinapay, kaya hindi na niya pwedeng kainin. KAHIT GUTOM SIYA, ANG ESTADO NG TINAPAY ANG NAGDIKTA NA HINDI ITO PWEDENG KAININ. Galit na galit si Pedrong bumalik sa tindahan para magreklamo. Pilit na ngumingiting sumagot ang dispatsadora, "Ang bakery po kasi ang nagtatatak ng expiry date, eh, hindi kami." Nanggagalaiting sumugod si Pedro sa bakery. Nakangising sumagot ang panadero, "Pare, 'nung Linggo niluto 'yan kaya 'yung susunod na Linggo ang tinatak naming expiry date. Maliban na lang kung nabilad sa araw ‘yan sa pag-deliver o may diperensiya ang harina." Tanong ni Pedro, "Paano ko malalaman kung nabilad nga sa araw ‘yan sa pag-deliver o may diperensiya nga ang harina?" Sagot ng panadero, "Malay ko. Mamaya pa ang balik ng delivery truck naming at Sabado ngayon, walang pasok ‘yung purchaser ng harina. Kung gusto mo, hintayin mo na lang ang truck o kaya bumalik ka na lang sa Lunes kapag may opisina na." Nag-isip nang mabuti si Pedro at tinanong sa sarili, “Kapag naghintay ba ako ngayon o bumalik sa Lunes, MAPAPAAMIN KO BA ‘YUNG NAG-DELIVER NA BINILAD NIYA ANG TINAPAY O ‘YUNG PURCHASER NA MAY DIPERENSIYA ‘YUNG BINILI NIYANG HARINA?” Matapos ang ilang minuto ay nagdesisyong umuwi na lang si Pedro dahil gutom na gutom na siya at naalala niyang may bahaw pa pala siya sa bahay na pwedeng isangag na lang. Nagpasiya siyang ipakain na lang ang sirang tinapay sa aso niya para hindi tuluyang masayang. Sa bawat hininga’t hakbang niya ay minumura niya ang dispatsadora, ang panadero, ang delivery boy at ang purchaser. Dumaan siya sa sari-sari store sa may kanto ng kalye nila para bumili ng itlog na itatambal niya sa sinangag. Pag-abot sa kanya ng tindera ng kanyang sukli, nakita niyang nakasulat sa may dingding, “BAWAL UTANG. NO RETURN, NO EXCHANGE. CAVEAT EMPTOR.” Pinagmasdan niyang mabuti ang itlog na nabayaran na niya at tinanong ang sarili, “May expiry date ba ang itlog?”

Wakas. O meme na ulit ang mga nagtutulug-tulugan.

bchoter
03-16-2006, 06:03 PM
Huling sagot ko na sa iyo ito dahil natutunan ko na sa mga kauri mo na hindi ka papayag na hindi ikaw ang may huling salita.
Huling salita... sa bawat pagtatalo naming magasawa nasa akin ang huling salita... "Yes 'ling! Tama ka 'ling!"


Ooops... sorry po OT

chba_dude
03-16-2006, 06:11 PM
Pansin mo na kaya umaalma ang mga Bedista at ibang walang common sense dito ay dahil gusto ninyong palabasin na nabiktima kayo?*

Ako lang ba o hindi ko gusto ang tunog nito? Hmmm...

LION
03-16-2006, 07:24 PM
Pansin mo na kaya umaalma ang mga Bedista at ibang walang common sense dito ay dahil gusto ninyong palabasin na nabiktima kayo?*

Ako lang ba o hindi ko gusto ang tunog nito? Hmmm...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Medyo malabo nga yata pare hehehe. Iwan na natin ang topic na ito. Let us move on.

tambay_sa_recto
03-16-2006, 07:32 PM
Pansin mo na kaya umaalma ang mga Bedista at ibang walang common sense dito ay dahil gusto ninyong palabasin na nabiktima kayo?*

Ako lang ba o hindi ko gusto ang tunog nito? Hmmm...










Pansin mo na kaya umaalma ang mga Bedista at ibang walang common sense dito ay dahil gusto ninyong palabasin na nabiktima kayo?*

Ako lang ba o hindi ko gusto ang tunog nito? Hmmm...


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------*

Medyo malabo nga yata pare hehehe. Iwan na natin ang topic na ito. Let us move on.




Mga kabayan, relax.* Huwag naman ninyo ako seryosohin.* Ako ay nangungutya lamang sa taong nag-post na tila may monopolya siya ng common sense.* Paumanhin kung ako ay nakasakit ng damdamin.

I second the motion na tigilan na natin ito.

Joescoundrel
03-16-2006, 07:37 PM
Will everyone please settle down. And whoever is in charge here could we please get a grip on every body. Don't lets get carried away. As lively and animated as the discussion here has been we could do without the histrionics. I'm quite certain the good Mr Bughao will soon be airing his side of this rather unfortunate turn of events at his earliest convenience. In the meantime perhaps we could turn our attention to other more pressing issues, such as when we will see Blue again in action. New tournaments anyone?

chba_dude
03-16-2006, 08:04 PM
Hindi naman ako nagagalit. Nililinaw ko na agad bago may makapansin na iba na makitid ang utak. ;)

LION
03-17-2006, 08:37 AM
Tambay,

Noted. Di lang ako sigurado kung nagbibiro ka o seryoso hehehe.

bombet
03-19-2006, 07:43 AM
Maybe what happened here is the same with what happened to La Salle. The recruiters of Bughao wanted him to play at Ateneo at the expense of doctoring his documents. Maybe a lot of money is involved. They thought they can get away with it but someone found out. Maybe that's why they won't field Bughao anymore in the UAAP. Like the recruiters of Gatchalian and Benitez, akala nila makakalusot habang buhay. I don't think the school officials are involved in these mess. Maybe they were just complacent with regards to verifying enrollees school records, marami raw kase masyado o kulang ang time nila...hehehe. Most likely the people sponsoring these student-athletes are the ones to blame. I believe the players themselves know these shenanigans. Ganyan talaga pag may pera involved. Marami kse mukhang pera sa atin e.

oca
03-19-2006, 11:01 AM
Maybe what happened here is the same with what happened to La Salle. The recruiters of Bughao wanted him to play at Ateneo at the expense of doctoring his documents. Maybe a lot of money is involved. They thought they can get away with it but someone found out. Maybe that's why they won't field Bughao anymore in the UAAP. Like the recruiters of Gatchalian and Benitez, akala nila makakalusot habang buhay. I don't think the school officials are involved in these mess. Maybe they were just complacent with regards to verifying enrollees school records, marami raw kase masyado o kulang ang time nila...hehehe. Most likely the people sponsoring these student-athletes are the ones to blame. I believe the players themselves know these shenanigans. Ganyan talaga pag may pera involved. Marami kse mukhang pera sa atin e.


Ayaw ko na sanang pahabain itong usapang ito. But this post is outright malicious.

Before anyone post anything on this topic, PLEASE CARE TO READ THE WHOLE THREAD. I am sure, your questions will be answered even before you could construct them.

Pero kung di sapat ang mga nakasulat rito para matugunan ang mga tanong ninyo, I suggest you GO TO FEU and ask for MARK MOLINA. (Dahil hardcore tayo rito, I suppose alam niyo kung saan ang gym na FEU, that's a good place to start.)

Who is Mark Molina? He is conected with FEU. He was publicly mentioned as having the inside info on the matter.

Kung ayaw niyo pumunta sa FEU, why not go to Ateneo and ask Bughao. I am sure he will answer your questions.

Kung wala kayong oras hanapin ang mga taong ito, MAGBASA MUNA BAGO MAGSULAT at MAGBASA NG MABUTI.

full battle gear
03-19-2006, 10:06 PM
Okay. I think a lot of people have aired their own opinions about this issue.

If you have some new facts to offer to further the discussions here, then go ahead and post. However, I will not tolerate the use of this thread as a venue for bashing. This is not the forum for that.

MonL
03-20-2006, 07:31 AM
Okay.* I think a lot of people have aired their own opinions about this issue.*

If you have some new facts to offer to further the discussions here, then go ahead and post.* However, I will not tolerate the use of this thread as a venue for bashing.* This is not the forum for that.




Well thank goodness for that....if you want to waste your time reading idiotic bashing, check out the NCAA.org.Forum and see how a forum can be so mishandled!

bchoter
03-20-2006, 12:48 PM
Hey bchoter! Welcome to our new playground. We've been tired of the tsismis and the non-sense bashing in the forums of the other sites. I think this is a perfect fora to have an honest to goodness intellectual discussion about philippine amatuer basketball from all schools and organizations nationwide. Feel free to invite your serious friends to join the fray but let's just limit this among us who have the genuine objective of intelelctual and mature exchanges.
Gil, I guess the honeymoon period is over. Seems like the hardcore success of this site is catching up on us.

gameface_one
03-21-2006, 12:20 AM
Bchoter,

Nope. We will not allow this to happen in our site. The mods in each sub-forum is advised to be vigilant and maintain the control and standards we have started in the Forums. So far, maximum tolerance is being implemented.

Gil_Andrews
03-21-2006, 12:26 AM
Thanks GF1 for the assurance.

Bchoter, suggest that we just ignore the "intruders" and continue with the high-level discsussions. This way, they will surely be "out of place" while GF1 and the mods do their jobs.

LION
03-21-2006, 07:50 AM
It is good to note that a certain standard is being implemented by the mods. I suggest that the more responsible posters of each school take the initiative of "admonishing" or "restraining" their peers or colleagues who may sometimes go way out of line.

Imagine this as our own basketball court. We should play a good game. Express yourself freely and responsibly. If you commit a foul, or transgress the simple rules of fair play, the refs will blow their whistle and charge you accordingly.

Ok, let's play ball.

tamarawz_14
03-21-2006, 04:55 PM
i'm from FEU... i remember in 2001 bughao is part of the varsity team last year of Avenido,Roldan,Castro (16 roster) benchwarmer nga lang c bughao...

Wang-Bu
08-31-2006, 11:20 PM
Tila yata kinuha ni Chua-lai si Bughao sa Sta Lucia.